1Password mini feedback

SystemSystem

Team Member
This discussion was created from comments split from: New 1Password Mini Feedback.
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  • I am astounded by how many times I use 1Password daily. Now that 7.3.BETA-2 has restored function and removed crashes, I can finally tell you what I really think of the new Mini UI.

    Where in the new Mini UI are Favorites? The use of a select set of 1Password objects in a Favorites list is a tool for frequently visited sites which may have several login objects. Favorites lets one go directly to a particular login without first opening the site and then using 1Password in a separate operation to select the desired login. A real world example might be accessing one of two different accounts with the same bank.

    Moving the Edit and Pin on Screen buttons to the bottom of the window is inconsistent with the main 1Password application as well as being a pain in the carpel tunnel. Users are trained by most applications to look for this kind of controls at the top of a window. I don't understand the motivation for this change. You are yet again requiring new muscle habits to be learned without providing a reward in the form of improved function.

    Regarding the use of "Pin", I understood the anchor and quickly learned the stacked boxes icon. At least they were in an expected place. You could as well use a pin icon -- we see those often.

    The Mini UI is the most often used 1Password interface and changes to the UI should provide improved clarity and function and not appear to be change for change's sake. Removal of the sidebar which allows the Mini to display Favorites seems to be in the latter category as well as removing the very handy shortcut function from the Mini.

  • MrCMrC Community Moderator

    I like how it is shaping up in general.

    So now I'll be a little more critical.

    The Edit control is at the bottom of this window, but at the top of the main UI window. Feels inconsistent and confusing. And the buttons are different sizes.

    I also don't like the "Pin on Screen" button. It seems verbose, anachronistic, skeuomorphic, and incorrectly located for a Window control.

    If you must use text, can you use something more succinct/direct/clear (e.g. Keep Open or Open Item)? (Who "Pins" anything on a Screen?)

    It should be at the top - we just clicked at the top of our 27" screen, now moved the mouse the bottom of the dialog, and then back up somewhere to copy/use an item. It's a lot of bouncing around. When you do click Pin..., the window is jarringly moved and quite different, so takes some mental processing to understand what just happened.

    RE: the Category pull down:

    • I don't like the appearance of this element - it feels / looks out of place.

    • It should always toggle the open/closed state when clicked - its seems to really want to stay open!

    • It should not cause a window drag when clicked.

    The window's size increases slightly when you click then drag up or down slightly on some element (Search area, Category pull down, etc.).

    I'd like to be able to increase mini's height. I can reduce its height... but not increase past some predefined height. Why not?

    If I double-click the search area, the window goes fly off towards the middle of the screen. Weird. Is that Pinned? Nope. Why did it just do that? But if I click Pin... I sometimes get an unfocused window, with greyed-out window controls:

    Even after clicking the window, it seems to stay unfocused.

    Ok, that's enough for now!

    Ah, one more....

    This Open and Fill / Copy pull down is just so difficult to target/use, and it now feels quite out of place stylistically. If I click the arrow, shouldn't a pull down appear at that very location, that stylistically looks the same as the existing Open and Fill text already there?

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    Hi @xz4gb8, I hope you don't mind that I split your post off into its own thread.

    Glad we were able to get things up and running for you again. I'll take your feedback point by point:

    Where in the new Mini UI are Favorites?

    Favorites are now always sorted to the top of every list. If you switch from the suggestions for the current site to All Items you will see your favorites there. Perhaps we need to add a specific "Favorites" menu item.

    Moving the Edit and Pin on Screen buttons to the bottom of the window is inconsistent with the main 1Password application as well as being a pain in the carpel tunnel.

    The thought was that these actions are necessary, but secondary functions of 1Password mini, so there was no need to give them top billing on the window. We went with words instead of icons because we can be clear and verbose with the purpose of the buttons, which is something we didn't always achieve with our icons.

    The Mini UI is the most often used 1Password interface and changes to the UI should provide improved clarity and function and not appear to be change for change's sake. Removal of the sidebar which allows the Mini to display Favorites seems to be in the latter category as well as removing the very handy shortcut function from the Mini.

    I assure you that none of the changes we've made were for change's sake. 🙂 That's not to say there aren't additional improvements to make, of course.

    as well as removing the very handy shortcut function from the Mini.

    I want to make sure I'm not missing something, can you fully describe this one? Which shortcut is missing?

    Thank you for the feedback, please keep it coming!

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    Wow, @MrC , thanks! I will go point by point on yours as well: 🙂

    The Edit control is at the bottom of this window, but at the top of the main UI window. Feels inconsistent and confusing. And the buttons are different sizes.

    True. We put the buttons where they make sense for the purposes of use in mini, which isn't the same as where they are in the main or pinned windows.

    I also don't like the "Pin on Screen" button. It seems verbose, anachronistic, skeuomorphic, and incorrectly located for a Window control. If you must use text, can you use something more succinct/direct/clear (e.g. Keep Open or Open Item)? (Who "Pins" anything on a Screen?)

    I will take this one under advisement. I would rather err on the side of being too verbose than unclear. Also, I "pin" things on screen. Constantly. 😄

    It should be at the top - we just clicked at the top of our 27" screen, now moved the mouse the bottom of the dialog, and then back up somewhere to copy/use an item. It's a lot of bouncing around. When you do click Pin..., the window is jarringly moved and quite different, so takes some mental processing to understand what just happened.

    Absolutely. I will file this one. The pinned window should appear where the detail view was. (Filed as apple-issues#3305).

    RE: the Category pull down:I don't like the appearance of this element - it feels / looks out of place. It should always toggle the open/closed state when clicked - its seems to really want to stay open! It should not cause a window drag when clicked. The window's size increases slightly when you click then drag up or down slightly on some element (Search area, Category pull down, etc.).

    We're working on a change here that should address these issues.

    I'd like to be able to increase mini's height. I can reduce its height... but not increase past some predefined height. Why not?

    Agreed. Filed as apple-issues#3306.

    If I double-click the search area, the window goes fly off towards the middle of the screen. Weird. Is that Pinned? Nope. Why did it just do that?

    What were you expecting to happen when you double clicked it? Currently we have double-clicking set up as a shortcut to recenter mini on your screen.

    But if I click Pin... I sometimes get an unfocused window, with greyed-out window controls: Even after clicking the window, it seems to stay unfocused.

    Are the controls actually disabled or just grey?

    This Open and Fill / Copy pull down is just so difficult to target/use, and it now feels quite out of place stylistically. If I click the arrow, shouldn't a pull down appear at that very location, that stylistically looks the same as the existing Open and Fill text already there?

    I played around with this one a little and I see what you're saying. Apparently my aim has been stellar so far and I've hit the hit target every time I've tried. I've filed this as apple-issues#3309.

  • MrCMrC Community Moderator
    edited March 14

    If I double-click the search area, the window goes fly off towards the middle of the screen. Weird. Is that Pinned? Nope. Why did it just do that?

    What were you expecting to happen when you double clicked it? Currently we have double-clicking set up as a shortcut to recenter mini on your screen.

    That shortcut is so unique (and to me bizarre, esp. since it is unidirectional), I'd a) never use it, b) want to turn if off immediately.

    At first, I tried to double-click my Search term to change the term (muscle memory, 30+ year habit of double click to select/type-to-replace). The window just moves away from me. (In fact, most clicks in that Search space seem to move the window). Grrrrr.. And its easy when you're moving quickly to mis-click (easy to do in the Dark Theme mode, where boundaries are very faint), the window goes away, you have to go re-open it, and its back at the top. This is easy to replicate if you triple click the extant search phrase (another muscle memory habit to select sentences or paragraphs). While you are clicking, after two clicks the window centers, and so your third click lands astray, dismissing the window!

    I can't reproduce the grey'd window controls anymore. I'll report if it occurs again.

    Also, I "pin" things on screen. Constantly

    Do you still have your cork-themed note pad with push pins through your sticky notes? :-)

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    Do you still have your cork-themed note pad with push pins through your sticky notes?

    Burn! (And maybe I do!)

    OK, thanks for the feedback on the double-click behavior, as well as the overly sensitive window moving behavior in general. We will talk about it internally.

  • MrCMrC Community Moderator
    edited March 14

    RE: the Open and Fill text target vs pull down arrow.

    On a 27" retina screen, sitting back at my normal 3 feet from the monitor, this little divider is nearly impossibly faint, and when you move your mouse across many URLs, it gives the sense that the entire thing is a pull down. It is a weird chimera - a button and a pull down at once. It would be awesome to get rid of the separation, and just have a hover action auto-expand the menu, and the user can then target the desired action (the mouse would already be at the correct default Open and Fill item).

  • MrCMrC Community Moderator

    Also, the hit coordinates are off. If I click to the left or right of the blue area, the action occurs.

  • johnclayjohnclay
    edited March 14

    In general, I'm quite liking the refresh.

    After using it for a few hours, what I'm disliking is the number of clicks to auto-fill non-login information that was previously readily available, such as identities and credit cards. Perhaps an option to always show non-login favourite items (i.e. only credit cards/identities).

    What was streamlined and quick now feels clunky and slow.

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    Indeed, @johnclay, you're right. This is something we're working to bring back.

  • @MrRooni That's great to hear. Looking forward to seeing that in a future beta.

    Something else I've noticed - the new mini truncates vault names after 11 (?) characters of name, regardless of the width of the window.

  • danvpetersondanvpeterson AWS Team

    Team Member

    @MrC thanks for the feedback about the additional hover options! I will talk about it some more internally and play around with the design there some more. I do think we can do more to make it clearer that they are two buttons. Hovering activating a menu feels like it would be a bit too distracting and cause more frustration for more users than help but I will keep it in mind as we play around with other ideas as well. The idea is that 90% of the time people want that primary action (copy or open the URL) so clicking anywhere will do that but on the occasions that they need those additional capabilities it's there, but not distracting when not needed.

  • MrCMrC Community Moderator

    Thanks. Consider making the hover automatic only when over the pull down area. No reply necessary, I've taken up enough of everyone's time.

  • xz4gb8xz4gb8
    edited March 14

    @MrRooni,

    "Hi @xz4gb8, I hope you don't mind that I split your post off into its own thread."

    • Fine - it is a good indication you are paying attention to your customers.

    "Favorites are now always sorted to the top of every list.

    • Not every list.

    "If you switch from the suggestions for the current site to All Items you will see your favorites there."

    • At first click, Favorites may be at the top , but scrolling of hundreds of items is very fiddly and hard to do compared to scrolling a list of 20 or so.
    • If I select a category, I expect a straight alphanumeric sort of that category. Any other sort order violates the principle of minimum astonishment.

    "(me)as well as removing the very handy shortcut function from the Mini."

    "I want to make sure I'm not missing something, can you fully describe this one? Which shortcut is missing?"

    • Not a shortcut for 1Password, but the "Shortcut Function" as in, for example, a login item for FaceBook which may be click to open the FaceBook page in Safari with the appropriate credentials automatically filled in.
    • My experience with the UI view below is that it provides access to categories, including favorites, and a particular object in 2 or 3 clicks. The new UI requires more clicks. (As others, including @MrRooni, have mentioned.)
    • The UI paradigm of sidebar selection of a category with the list of objects to the right is well established in the macOS world. The Finder, iTunes, and Mail's classic view are among many examples.
    • The more CDO among us (CDO is OCD spelling for OCD) expect unmixed sortable items in a column. Column: from, column2, etc. Mixing categories and category members engenders uncomfortable cognitive dissonance.

    • I do like the Mini UI resizing, but still am offended by a tear-off popdown which won't stay where I put it.

    If you perceive that I am fussy about UI design - you betcha. Been doing it for decades. And my 1Password invocations via the Keyhole icon occur literally dozens of time every day. So I notice the small stuff, like adding an extra click to get to my favorites.

  • I like the general appearance, however, as others have touched on... the fact that I have to go through extra steps to find my Favorites is incredibly frustrating. There's a reason they're my favorites — because I use them often, even on sites which may have other suggestions. (e.g. I have various credit/debit cards favorited because I enter them on sites with some frequency.)

    To access favorites now, I not only have to change the box from the suggestion to All Items, but I also have to scroll up to the top of the list because the suggested site is still selected (which may be at the very bottom of the list of accounts). This is poor UX.

    I agree with @xz4gb8 in that the sidebar paradigm is incredibly well established and understood by users. This could have been improved upon without being removed entirely. One example would be to use spinners to open/collapse the categories. Have "Suggested" and "Favorites" always available, but collapse "Categories" into a single line until the user touches it.

    Only real issues with the previous iteration of the Mini UI was that it was a little too "sticky" when it came to remembering which account you had selected previously, to the point of overriding the site's suggestions because you may have viewed something else.


    When you edit an entry, instead of staying in the same UI, it now opens up a pinned window with no clear way to get back to the Mini UI. For instance, I hit Edit so that I could delete a Password entry... not only did it pop up and not give me a clear way back, deleting the Password didn't even close the edit box. The "Edit" state ended, but other than that there was no visible state change whatsoever.

    In reality, even though I hit "Move to Trash" and then confirmed the action, no action was performed at all. The edit state ended, but the item was not moved to the trash. Opening Mini and viewing the Password category showed that the entry was still present.


    Pressing Escape while focused on a pinned window should close it.

  • pdadocpdadoc Junior Member

    Overall like the new mini layout, BUT major issues with use.... Despite credit card input screen showing in Safari, ONLY see login options. If need to fill in identity, NOT seeing that either. Only way to get these is to click in upper left corner and CHOOSE credit card or identity. Previously, these options would just show on the left, so it's an extra, unwanted step. Let me know if missing something!... Using beta 3 (just out), and on Mojave.

  • MrCMrC Community Moderator

    This is easy to replicate if you triple click the extant search phrase (another muscle memory habit to select sentences or paragraphs). While you are clicking, after two clicks the window centers, and so your third click lands astray, dismissing the window!

    This is particularly egregious...

    I just triple-clicked to select text (testing to see if this behavior had changed in the just-posted beta - It hasn't). After the first two of three quick clicks, the window moved from under my mouse, and the third click landed on my Delete button on Mail, deleting a mail item. Ouch.

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    @johnclay Thanks for this one:

    Something else I've noticed - the new mini truncates vault names after 11 (?) characters of name, regardless of the width of the window.

    I've filed this as apple-issues#3316

  • OAWOAW Junior Member
    edited March 15

    Overall I like the smaller mini. Even at the expense of the loss of the sidebar for categories. Yes it necessitates more clicks to access other categories besides Suggested Items .... but for me at least the primary use case for the mini is filling Logins, Credit Card, and Identity information from this section. So I'm good with the trade-off here. A few suggestions ...

    1. We definitely need the return of Credit Card and Login information to the Suggested Items section. It's listed as a "known issue" so I presume it's coming.

    2. Favorites should be an option in the category drop down to be consistent with the main app. I really dislike how it currently sorts favorited items in a category at the top of the list and then sorts the rest of the list alphabetically. It's jarring and unintuitive. So a dedicated Favorites section solves this problem in a much more straightforward and intuitive manner.

    3. CMD+\ doesn't auto-fill the single available login on a website if generated passwords also exist. It displays the mini and forces you to choose.

  • I too do not like that the categories are hidden in the menu at the top. It is less intuitive, more clicks, and not as visually pleasing as I would expect from 1Password. Every other part of the interface seems designed really nicely, but this feels like a step backward.

    Additionally, the new look of the fields seems like a dramatic departure from the design in the app without accompanying app changes causing there to be a disparity between the app and the mini.

  • Pinning an item select in the Beta Mini UI works fine except...

    • Dragging a related item (e.g., a PDF) to a pinned item in Edit mode enters the related item correctly.
    • After Save of the Edit, there is no immediate access to any related item via the pinned object.
    • Dragging a related item (e.g., a PDF) to a pinned item not in Edit mode fails to enters the document.

    These behaviors are in strong contrast to the full 1Password UI and do not seem reasonable.

  • andmadeandmade
    edited March 17

    Regarding Beta Mini:

    • I don't like the new way the Edit functions. Now if you hit Edit, it opens a new window and then there is no way to get back to the list of logins without closing the new window out and launching the mini again. Before you could Edit and Save all in one window and it didn't disappear after Save.
    • I miss the sidebar actually. It's now less convenient to access the Credit Card fill in (which I do a lot) and the Identity fills. You can't navigate to different sections using the keyboard as easily anymore.
    • The "+ New Password' function/generator is nice. But I noticed after I generated a password, I could not rebring up the mini using the keyboard shortcut.
    • Also, is the favorite button gone? I couldn't readily tell how to favorite an item from the new version.
    • I'm glad to know you are pushing favorites to the top of the results. I had to creatively name my favorites to accomplish this before. Although, the Android version still doesn't do this, so those creative names will remain.

    I don't want to seem overly negative, but well, I liked the previous mini just fine. But, I also use the Windows version, whose mini is so behind the MacOS mini that maybe I glossed over any faults. I never even had to open the actual 1Password app on MacOS because the old mini was so awesome and capable. This one seems a step back, so I will opt out of the beta at this time (though I realize this is only delaying the inevitable...).

  • ag_andrewag_andrew

    Team Member

    Hi @andmade,

    Thanks for your feedback!

    We felt like there was enough we wanted out of a "mini" item view that it warranted building a new one from the ground-up with 1Password mini in mind. Because this was already a huge task that we wanted to nail, we didn't add on the ability to edit your items in the mini itself. This is something that may happen in the fullness of time, but for now we have pop-out editing, and we'll do our best to make this as seamless as possible; there are still a few rough edges as you mentioned.

    We're looking into some more powerful keyboard navigation options with respect to the categories, but for now I'll challenge you to give our Search field a workout. Just start typing a few characters of your credit card and it should come right to the top. From there, you can navigate to a field and press return to copy it (or use your mouse, whichever you prefer).

    I will have a look at New Passwords breaking the keyboard shortcuts, that sounds like a bug we want to squash. :smile:

    You're right that there's currently no easy way to favorite an item. We'll look for a good spot to do that.

    I'm glad you like the prioritization of favorites, I do too.

    Thank you again so much for your time and your feedback. I'm sorry you don't feel like you can stay on the beta ride with us; feedback from users like you makes the app better for everyone. Please let us know if you have any other thoughts or questions.

  • @ag_andrew said, in part, "We're looking into some more powerful keyboard navigation options with respect to the categories ..."

    I use shortcuts all the time, especially the bottom row (z,x,c,v,b,n) but, like many others, for less frequent operations I am very visually oriented. Don't forget us.

  • ag_andrewag_andrew

    Team Member

    @xz4gb8 we try to keep all our users in mind, and this beta forum is a great way for you to let us know what's working and what isn't.

    Please do give our Search a try next time you want to navigate to an item, we think it's one of the best "keyboard shortcuts" in Mini, just type a few letters from the item you're looking for! I'd like to make the search even more powerful so hit us up with improvements you'd like to see.

  • @ag_andrew
    I use search often, now in the beta more often than I want. Eyeball searches of well composed lists often are superior because the brain can do pattern recognition quite effectively, even if the exact spelling is not available.

    Specifically to your request:

    • Make the category list visible whenever possible.
    • Make Favorites the top category
      • Because Favorites are, well, favorites
      • Because including Favorites in every category, including All Items makes scrolling Favorites awkward, as the tiny scroll bar should make obvious. Favorites will fail to be favored if they continue to be this annoying.
  • ag_andrewag_andrew

    Team Member

    @xz4gb8 Awesome, thank you!

    We are considering some changes to make the category list easier to access, but it's unlikely that the category list will always be visible.

    We will likely be adding Favorites as an item to the category menu. That will show only your favorites and should be much easier to scroll.

    Thanks again and keep the feedback coming!

  • kitmoskitmos Senior Member

    The mini version that just landed is a huge improvement over the 1st beta! Fixes all of my gripes so far.

  • Just want to echo the above sentiments regarding credit card filling.

    The extra interaction of having to use the mouse to select the credit card is quite tedious now, whereas you could just use the arrow keys previously

  • ag_andrewag_andrew

    Team Member

    @kitmos Thanks very much! Keep sending us gripes and we'll do our best to fix 'em.

    @defiant We feel the pain too. We're working on it.

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