Setup with standalone vault [restored for paid customers in 7.3.4]

124

Comments

  • @brenty,

    As always, you'd need to have backed up your data preemptively using a computer, and have that handy to restore from for that to be an option.

    If using the iOS integrated backup mechanism to iCloud / iCloud drive there is no need to back up data preemptively using a computer. The data will be recovered on a new device the same way as from 1PW membership cloud, either by using credentials to apple membership or 1PW membership. There is only an advantage of 1PW membership if a user want to migrate from iOS to Android, but that is another discussion.

    And now, in addition to that, with 1Password memberships, I can't see any logic in us making people who are already paying a subscription pay again if they want to use 1Password on one or more iOS devices. So it's a free download with options to sign up for a new (paid) membership, sign into an existing (paid) membership, or sync an existing vault from the (paid) app on another device. Hope that helps.

    You missed two groups of users:
    1) people who already paid for the app in iOS app store (about 7$ don't remember exactly) to use a standalone solution on iOS without the need of an additional computer or a membership
    2) people who got the free version from the app store and paid for the pro features (as @exitstrategy said above)

    For both groups there is exactly the logic you are referring to, making people who already paid for a feature (which was now removed) to pay again if they want to use 1Password on one or more iOS devices.

    While I can understand a little bit from a commercial point of view what your strategy (which I personally don't like) is for new people (who can of cause decide on their own if they want to use the somewhat dictated way or not), I cannot understand why you affront loyal customers who supported you for many years in such a way. That makes me sad!

  • @brenty no it does not clarify things. It just makes you look like you did this because you wanted to. Because if you didn’t not want your app to be listed with free apps the solution is easier than removing a seldom-used but very important feature (when it is used).

  • I mean, back when 1Password on iOS was a paid app I liked it so much I bought a second copy (gift) which I have never given away.

    I installed and bought it for my parents, I recommended it to friends.

    No more. Trust has been lost.

  • You missed two groups of users:
    1) people who already paid for the app in iOS app store (about 7$ don't remember exactly) to use a standalone solution on iOS without the need of an additional computer or a membership
    2) people who got the free version from the app store and paid for the pro features (as @exitstrategy said above)

    For both groups there is exactly the logic you are referring to, making people who already paid for a feature (which was now removed) to pay again if they want to use 1Password on one or more iOS devices.

    While I can understand a little bit from a commercial point of view what your strategy (which I personally don't like) is for new people (who can of cause decide on their own if they want to use the somewhat dictated way or not), I cannot understand why you affront loyal customers who supported you for many years in such a way. That makes me sad!

    I'm in this group, paid for the original app, and the pro add-on. It really concerns me that the pro add-on seems to have disappeared now. Are there any missing features because of that? what happens if I reinstall the app? do I not get those features back anymore?

    I'm seriously getting pretty annoyed at the attitudes (perceived or otherwise) that the 1Password team (appear) take to things here. Whether it's the silencing of the security issues with the Windows v7 app, rejection of removed features from v6 like list view as 'not many people use it' or how issues like this crop up and are handled. It seems as though a reality check is needed, the 1P folk need to remember they're here for the customers. I want to keep using 1Password, but as time goes on the relationship is getting significantly stretched by growing mistrust and disappointment in how things like this are handled - and as the people responsible for keeping my passwords and other very sensitive data safe... I need to have ABSOLUTE trust in what you do - I'm finding that really hard lately. You guys need to start listening to your customers and finding better/smarter less blunt ways of going about things.

    For example, if you're going to remove a feature, don't do it silently, that just looks bad - and you end up with threads like this. Also when people raise the issue, don't just casually dismiss it because you can't see the other sides point of view (maybe you don't see it that way but that's the way it comes across). Listen. Understand. How about consult users here? How about consider an alternative method like making it a 'Pro' feature? how about providing warnings in the app about backups or recommendations for the not so smart users? How about make it a toggle in the settings? ('allow creation of local vaults') how about pop up a warning when that gets turned on? All of that could have been discussed and done BEFORE this change. Thus avoiding this current situation.

    By the way, where has that 'Pro' feature page gone, it's now totally missing from my app, I can't find it anywhere. How do I know if I still have those features? How can I restore them if I reinstall the app?

    I'll also just say, personally, the removal of creating local vaults on iOS does not directly affect me, however I (disappointingly) found this thread via HackerNews, and felt (after reading it) that I needed to add my thoughts.

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    Good morning, @warpspeed. The Pro Features purchase has been removed from sale, but all the features that would have been unlocked have been maintained. There is no longer anything to restore. The more I've been thinking about it, the more I am coming down on the side of restoring the single standalone vault capability for those that previously purchased the Pro Features (or the full price app when it was a paid download long ago).

    Thank you for sharing your thoughts, I do appreciate it.

  • @MrRooni

    The more I've been thinking about it, the more I am coming down on the side of restoring the single standalone vault capability for those that previously purchased the Pro Features (or the full price app when it was a paid download long ago).

    That'd be a fair move, especially for the old long-term users, and I'd really appreciate it.

  • Since I see no response to my post, I will ask again :

    I was pointed out the existence of this thread, and now I am confused.

    My setup : I store everything locally on the phone. I don’t want my data to appear on any cloud server at any point in time. I make regular backups of my data, using the backup feature in the app, and store those backups on my backup drives. Making sure those backups get there without passing any cloud server.

    Now, consider my phone getting destroyed. What are my options to restore my backup on a new phone? Do I need a subscription? Do I need to store my data in the cloud?

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    @Avace Sorry to have missed your original post. You do not need to use any cloud storage. Much like the directions I gave to Tyler above, you can AirDrop a backup file to your phone, open it in 1Password, and restore your data that way.

  • NiklasNiklas
    edited July 13

    If we make an iTunes backup (encrypted, of course) does that include all 1Password data or not?

  • @MrRooni, thanks for the reply, but sorry , still don't fully get it.

    1. My question if I need a subscription in order to do a restore is still not answered.
    2. If your suggestions are correct, it IS still possible to have a standalone local, non-synced vault. While at the same time suggesting that you removed this possibility because you don't want users losing data when their phone get lost.
    3. I tried the procedure on my iPad. The backup file is a *.1p4_zip file. On my iPad i can get it in the files app using airdrop, but I cannot direct it to be opened with 1Password. 1Password is not shown in the extended list of all apps that can handle 1p4_zip files. Are you sure this should work?
  • Very disappointed by removing such a critical feature silently. A responsible way would have been to send the depreciation notice so people could have updated there workflows accordingly or do other arrangements. But surprisingly you guys did not even bother to put it in release notes.

    I might have to rethink now before recommending 1P to friends and family.

  • This is super disappointing, I've been a 1Password customer for years and recently migrated from V6 to the subscription product to try it out. However I've set all my family and siblings up with Dropbox or iCloud-synced vaults over the years, and when working in tech-support I always recommended 1Password as a simple and affordable standalone solution to look after passwords without needing cloud-syncing subscriptions - which especially helped elderly clients. I hope you reconsider this move as I've always enjoyed using and recommending 1Password.

  • Also long time customer, also disappointed. I will no pay for any subscription but will purchase one-time pay software.

  • https://reddit.com/r/apple/comments/cd5k82/1password_ios_silently_removed_major_features_and/

    You guys made the front page of /r/Apple

    Maybe it would be helpful to get feedback by reading that thread.

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    @Niklas I believe that if you make an encrypted iTunes backup you can restore from that backup and your 1Password information will be intact.

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    @Avace Sorry about that, let me take your questions one at a time:

    1. You do not need a subscription to restore from a backup. This feature is available to all users.
    2. There are definitely ways of keeping backups of local, non-synced data. We do try and guide folks into keeping that data synced, however, because it provides the most up-to-date safety net for all their information.
    3. 1Password for iOS can make and restore its own backups (via Settings > Advanced > Create Backup). You can pull these files off your phone using iTunes File Sharing. At this time 1Password for iOS cannot restore 1p4_zip backups from 1Password for Mac.

    I hope that clears things up, but if not don't hesitate to follow up.

  • edited July 15

    @MrRooni I commend you for the last few comments in this thread that are addressing issues, however this whole thread has become something else too. It is a start for what has probably occurred before but finally come time for me. A reevaluation of my trust in 1Password. I was severely disappointed in the the 1Password 7 release for Mac. The whole direction of the paid product was in antithesis to the way I wanted to pay and conduct my secret management. At the time, since 1Password 6 was and is still functional I continued hoping the company would reevaluate a subscription only model. In that time I have searched for what my alternatives would be in that case, and they are few but capable with a short term cost. That short term cost will soon be worth it if features continue to be removed from previously paid for product.

    I championed 1Password as one of the darling of the Mac platform. In the last year+ though, I do not mention this company when I talk to new users.

  • ankushnarulaankushnarula Junior Member

    I've been a standalone user since Nov 2008, but as of 2017 I began primarily rely on the subscription service for general personal web accounts. However, I do still use standalone vaults & Dropbox sync to duplicate my OTP/2FA and for business & critical accounts. If I'm reading all of this correctly, I should remain unaffected as long as I continue to pay for a subscription.

    Although I do wonder if I ever lapse or stop my 1P subscription, will my standalone vaults continue to work across my devices under the original standalone license?

    While I'm not overly concerned for myself at the moment - or for the many who I've referred to this product - I would echo the concerns of others about how poorly this change was communicated. If I were more cynical, I'd say the handling of this change was cynical. Having worked long enough in software change management I'm quite familiar with the adage "it's easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission".

    But I'll give you guys the benefit of the doubt that you're trying to do the right thing. Hopefully you'll make those iOS standalone users whole with an update.

  • @MrRooni, thanks for your response, but again, this does not work.

    I can place my backup data in the 1Password folder using iTunes, but like you write, to restore it I need to go to the settings menu.

    However, just at the moment you need this settings menu the most : when you lost the device that has all your passwords stored, so you bought a new phone, downloaded 1Password again, and placed the backup files in the folder in order to restore your data ... just at that moment access to the settings menu is blocked.

    When doing a clean install and starting 1Password for the time users are presented with these questions, even ( and I tested this ) when a backup file is placed in the root folder of the app.

    • Register 1Password
    • Download data from 1Password.com
    • Download data from iCloud
    • Download data from Dropbox
    • Download data from a WLAN Server

    So, how should I proceed to restore my backup?

  • I am disappointed in you, not only for just removing function and then telling people they are wrong to complain but also for your very unfriendly answers.
    As soon as I have some free time I will move my existing 1password installation to another better software and friendlier software developer team.

  • TheDJTheDJ
    edited July 15

    Another F'up with communication. I'm still on v6 because I just don't understand what you guys are doing/where you are going and if i'm still gonna be a customer you care about in that future.
    Been looking at Enpass and Bitwarden lately. It's hard to say goodbye to a product you have used for soooo long. But i'm just no longer confident with 1Password lately.

  • I gotta tell you, as a long time customer this thread has really soured me on AgileBits. I'm not sure if it is a matter of tone-deafness or something else, but the way company employees have behaved in this thread seems very patronizing and condescending to me.

    All those little winky-face emojis and 'thanks for your feedback' feel like another way of saying 'F you.'

  • MrRooniMrRooni

    Team Member

    @Avace In testing this myself this morning, you're absolutely right. I'll get this fixed up and ready to go for our 7.3.4 update.

  • As a-long-term customer, the removal of the local vault does not affect me at all, it is something I will never use anyway. Nevertheless, I am still baffled with the way you handled this. Why would you risk your reputation of being honest, open and having integrity in this manner? The loss of revenue if you have announced this clearly is heavily preferable to the loss of revenue by having your reputation stained in the long run. It makes no business sense to me what-so-ever, because your reputation of being honest, open and having integrity is your business model, especially in an industry where customer loyalty is very high.

    I will remain a customer despite this. I just hope you will consider the above; a big mistake and a lesson learnt.

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