Sorting out Favourites for teams and families

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Comments

  • I can’t believe it’s taken more than a year to make no progress on addressing this.

    As others have mentioned - I struggle to believe most people would expect that if they are in a family or team, that those other users favourites (possibly people you dont even know) would trump their own ONLY on iOS?

    It doesn’t do this in the Mac app - it shows it in a sensible order, mine first, then family, then team (the last two might be reversed as thankfully I’m not in a team any more.

    I suspect very few of your customers are in all 3 so I would Question if you’ve really studied your analytics.

    But here’s the obvious suggestion - let me pick the order of those 3 groups. I want mine, family, team others could select team, family, personal.

    For bonus points - let me hide one group if I don’t want it.

    And please, please make it consistent - it drives me nuts that it’s one way on my Mac and another on my phone!

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    I suspect you're probably right, @365nice. Frankly it comes down to a matter of priorities, though. We've had relatively little feedback on this topic. That isn't to say that we don't care, and don't ultimately want to improve the situation here, but there are lots of other things we want to improve as well and so far this hasn't outweighed them.

    Ben

  • Lets hope another year doesn't go by where you found the time to add most recently used (above fav's - which is a decent feature btw) but not fix this....

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    Just because something has been requested n [time interval] ago doesn't mean we're going to prioritize it over everything else. That just doesn't make sense. As we complete other projects which have seen significantly higher demand we're reevaluating what then most needs our attention though. Thanks for letting us know this is the most important change you'd like to see in 1Password! It's good to hear that you're otherwise satisfied. We'll keep plugging away. :)

  • @brenty I find your response a little sarcastic - bugs should be fixed, and it’s a bug that favourite order is different on iOS from OS X - and it makes the product less usable on iOS for the reasons described above.

    I also find it a bit hypocritical that you hear interviews with agile bits on podcasts like “vector” where you promote the care and attention to detail that goes into the product. But yes, Maybe I'm the only guy that finds it annoying that some critical passwords I’ve favourited appear in inconstant places across devices, made worse if you’ve actually bought more of the product..

    I still like many features of course (and faceid support is nice - although I wish you could turn off the extra animation, the novelty wears off and it slows lookup down)

  • LarsLars Junior Member

    Team Member

    @365nice - I can't speak for brenty directly, but I doubt he was being sarcastic. I can speak for brenty this far: I know he's serious in thanking you for your input on this topic; all of us at AgileBits feel very fortunate to have such an active and involved user base that's not in the least shy about trumpeting the features they love or the ones they'd like to see (or things they'd like to see fixed) in 1Password! It helps us gauge where the user-base sentiment is on various issues and frequently has an affect on what gets worked on, or with what degree of importance/priority.

    But it's important for me to reiterate what brenty pointed out: "frequently" doesn't mean "always," and in some cases even highly-requested features or bug-fix issues may not be addressed within a time-frame that their most passionate advocates consider reasonable, because we have an ever-changing workload an priority list which isn't always within our control. Certainly we agree in general that "bugs should be fixed." But even there, some bugs present a serious threat to security or usability, others simply don't. As a result, priorities shift, based on how many people a given issue affects, how serious it is, how simple or challenging it will likely be to address in terms of developer-(and/or designer-) hours, and several other factors.

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    @365nice: I apologize for my earlier comments. I can see how they can be taken that way. This is something we do care deeply about, but what I was trying to convey is that everything has a costing terms of time and energy (if nothing else), so we do need to prioritize the things that can have the greatest impact — or are the most pressing, like browser compatibility. This isn't a bug but rather a byproduct of how 1Password handles vaults, and always has. I agree that a new design is in order since people are using 1Password differently now than they have in the past, but there is a lot that goes into changing something like this behind the scenes, and many other improvements that need to be made first. Again, I'm sorry I did such a poor job of communicating that. :blush:

  • Thank you, AgileBits employees, for your willingness to communicate so openly with your customers. I have very warm feelings towards 1Password and you due to your hard work over the years adding major features and communicating about them.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    Thanks for the kind words, @ILove1P!

    Ben

  • @rickfillion – Any update on the family favorite discussion? I appreciate (at least some of) the complexities involved in making a change like this, but the idea of all family members needing to have the same favorite items really makes that feature less powerful for family accounts.

    While the underlying functionality may not have changed when you introduced families, you were certainly trying to get customers to use your products differently, which I believe warrants looking at this functionality again.

    Hoping you can share an update on your priorities and thought process behind the family favorites problem.

    Thanks!
    Dan

  • rickfillionrickfillion Junior Member

    Team Member

    We have no update to share on that. It's still a problem we want to see solved as it annoys us personally.

    Rick

  • Hi,

    I'd like to add my experience with the favourites issue. Our team is starting to use 1Password more and more (transitioning from a competitor), and we've been getting a bit confused by how favourites work. Several of my colleagues have been experiencing some strange behaviour where they'd favourite something but the next day it'd be gone, or where seemingly random items would continuously turn up in their favourites list.
    I'd actually come to the discussion forum to post a bug report about this, but then came across this thread. It seems like this behaviour won't be changed in the near future, but I think perhaps some way of letting users know (a tooltip on the favourite button, or something?) that the setting is per-item, not per-user, would help reduce some frustration.

    Echoing @ILove1P, I'm continually impressed with how open and forthcoming you guys are, with seemingly endless patience for your users (and even probably-never-will-be-users, HN gets pretty rowdy sometimes).

    Cheers,
    Sean

  • LarsLars Junior Member

    Team Member

    Welcome to the forum, @wipash! Thanks so much for dropping by and sharing your experience/wishes, as well as the kind words for 1Password and our team. Almost exactly 100 people work pretty hard to make 1Password the best it can possibly be, and while we don't expect praise for doing our jobs, it's always a breath of fresh air for us to hear that someone in the user community thought we hit the mark.

    Favorites is definitely an area we thinks needs some greater coordination/attention. And while we continue to have no update to share right now (being kinda preoccupied with getting both 1Password 7 for Mac and 1Password 7 for Windows out the door), it's something we'd like to revisit once the high tide recedes a bit. Cheers! :)

    (side note: yes, HN can get pretty rough sometimes. I've actually been very pleased with how positive and even, dare I say, collegial it's seemed over there the last few days).

  • funzylfunzyl
    edited June 2018

    Hi there!
    I would like to add that I find the current behaviour of favourites per item very confusing. Since every family member has their own favourite sites and logins, it would be great if items that are in a shared family vault could still be marked as favourite by one family member without that transferring to the other ones.

    As others have already pointed out, I also want to thank you for your open way of communicating! :)

    funzyl

  • LarsLars Junior Member

    Team Member

    Welcome to the forum, @funzyl! Yes, I think that's an excellent idea as well. Unfortunately, talking with our developers, it gets thorny quickly, as you expect to have your own favorites in the same order on every instance (app) you use 1Password on. But some devices may include different vaults/accounts than others, and when you add in the complexity of separating out different family members' favorites, it gets...more difficult to do correctly than it might seem. Nevertheless, it's an area we'd like to work to improve as well. Thanks for taking the time to voice your thoughts. :)

  • Hi there!
    Do you have any update on this topic? Unfortunately, I just got frustrated with favorites once again because one of my family members added some favorites from a shared account and so my favourites list got messed up. I really hope there will be an option for individual favorites soon. Currently we duplicate items from a shared vault into our private vaults when someone wants to have them in their favorites. While this keeps the favorites lists per individual, it defeats the purpose of shared vaults. :|

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    We don't have anything to announce in this area. Favorites are an old 1Password feature, and they are built around vaults. I think there are good reasons to rethink the whole thing in the context of families (and teams), but we're not going to throw out what we have and introduce something completely new until we have not only a clean way of doing it, but also a path forward for folks who've been using 1Password for over a decade now. Some people's workflows depend on how it works today, so we need to avoid disrupting that if we can, and have something better to offer in exchange, especially since this is people's data.

  • Any rough guess on when you might have an updated implementation of favorites? We use the 1Password for Teams and favoriting items is a complete mess right now. We need the favorites to be on a per user basis. Thanks!

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member
    edited February 2019

    Hi @socaljoker

    I don't have any news to share at this time, but as Rick mentioned above it affects our team as well, and is definitely something we'd like to address.

    Ben

    ref: xplatform/b5book#879

  • We'll look into its potential.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    :+1:

    Ben

  • Just coming back to this thread after a couple of years because I was about to sign up for a Family account.*

    Earlier in the thread it was noted that "We've had relatively little feedback on this topic." So if nothing else this is just a post to say that even if the volume of feedback is relatively low, please don't mistake that for how passionately it frustrates those users who recognise the problem.

    This seems like one of those "It Just Works" issues – until users have seen a better way perhaps they don't appreciate just how poor the old way actually was?


    *With the way iOS now plays nicely with 1P I think it's finally at the point that my elderly mother, my partner and my young teenage son will find 1P easy enough to use that they'll actually use it, rather than blame me for making their lives a misery. But I can imagine the favourites behaviour could confuse them no end. Ideally I reckon I'd encourage individual family members to maintain their own vaults to avoid this issue, but then I wonder if it would be better if I had complete access to all their data, because my mother will die at some point, and it would be much easier if I was able to access her info at that time, and because I fear both my mother and son are not technically proficient/confident enough that I want to risk them locking themselves out of their own data by mistake. (Note that I haven't investigated the administrator role yet, so perhaps my fears are unfounded)

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    Earlier in the thread it was noted that "We've had relatively little feedback on this topic." So if nothing else this is just a post to say that even if the volume of feedback is relatively low, please don't mistake that for how passionately it frustrates those users who recognise the problem.

    Absolutely. And were we designing 1Password from scratch today, we'd probably do things differently. There just isn't a simple solution to this problem. It is one we'd like to solve though.

    This seems like one of those "It Just Works" issues – until users have seen a better way perhaps they don't appreciate just how poor the old way actually was?

    That's certainly possible. But at the same time 1Password has worked this way for more than a decade now, so there are a lot of people who are used to this. I'm not saying that's a good argument to keep it this way, but it's important to acknowledge that any change we make can impact the workflow of literally millions of users, and if even 1% of them prefer the "old" way (in my imaginary future), even merely due to inertia and habit, that's a lot of unhappy campers. So we do want to make sure that anything we do in this area we do right, and also that the pros outweigh the cons -- not to mention the technical challenges.

    *With the way iOS now plays nicely with 1P I think it's finally at the point that my elderly mother, my partner and my young teenage son will find 1P easy enough to use that they'll actually use it, rather than blame me for making their lives a misery. But I can imagine the favourites behaviour could confuse them no end. Ideally I reckon I'd encourage individual family members to maintain their own vaults to avoid this issue, but then I wonder if it would be better if I had complete access to all their data, because my mother will die at some point, and it would be much easier if I was able to access her info at that time, and because I fear both my mother and son are not technically proficient/confident enough that I want to risk them locking themselves out of their own data by mistake. (Note that I haven't investigated the administrator role yet, so perhaps my fears are unfounded)

    I'm glad if 1Password Families helps you protect your loved ones! And, just to clarify, each family member you invite will indeed have their own account with a Master Password they choose and their own Personal/Private vault, which only they can access. And so long as you or another Organizer is alive to help them do it, they can perform account recovery if they forget their Master Password or other account credentials. And if you have any questions at all, we're here for you. :)

  • I would like to revive this thread as this is something that affects myself and our entire company. We use 1Password across several departments, many of which share vaults for various equipment and websites where necessary. Some people like favoriting things, some don't. Here is a thought that came to mind:
    Implement a new "Team Favorites" or "Family Favorites" and also a new "Personal Favorites" meta setting. Current favorites would transition to the personal favorites meta at install/upgrade time and then be ignored, so each person can adjust it as they see fit after 1password upgrade and shouldn't affect other instances of the app. The new "Team Favorite" or "Family Favorite" option would be another menu choice that, when selected, would force the item to be a favorite for everyone sharing that vault/item and would gray out the personal favorite option for that item. But again it would not alter the "old" meta favorite. Since it's newer metadata, older versions of 1Password could still pay attention to the old favorite meta option and ignore the newer favorite meta options.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    Team Member

    Thanks @adamkennedy. The hang up is that such a change currently requires coordinated efforts across all of our client apps as well as updates on the server side. It isn't that we don't have the inclination to do it, just that we have to get the timing right. It is a problem we want to address. We're affected by it ourselves as well. :)

    Ben

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