Synced via wifi and all data lost, then it synced to icloud and wiped that...?!

ajburnetajburnet
edited November 2016 in iOS

Hi. I'm a 1Password user on my devices and I recommended it to my Dad some time ago. He wanted a password safe on his imac but wasn't prepared to pay the high monthly or licence fee for 1Password so wanted to remove the data from his ios app.

He still uses an old iphone 4 with ios 1password version 4.5.3 which doesn't allow syncing with a 1password account, and the trial version of the desktop doesn;t allow sync either. In other words, there is no way to access HIS personal data on the ios version (since it can't be upgraded either given the ios version). That strikes me as a bad situation to not have control of your data.

I attempted to assist by making a backup of my primary vault, clearing it and setting up a wifi sync with his ios (with the correct secret etc.). However, it synced one way, by overwriting his ios 1password app during the sync, in other words, it deleted everything in his vault. It then synced to his icloud and so deleted that in essence.

We appear to have lost his vault! surely it should SYNC both ways? Any ideas on how we could recover? I can't see anything unless there are historical syncs or the like in icloud?

Thanks,

Alex.


1Password Version: 4.5.3
Extension Version: Not Provided
OS Version: ios 7
Sync Type: iCloud

Comments

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    @ajburnet: Thanks for reaching out. I’m sorry for the confusion! iOS 7 and earlier use an old version of iCloud. The new iCloud service is only available on Yosemite/iOS 8 or higher. A better option would be to use Dropbox, since that isn't limited my platform or OS version. :dizzy:

    It also sounds like you took a vault on your Mac, modified it by deleting the data, and then sync'd it with his device, which resulted in the newer vault replacing the old. The best thing to do would be to restore the data from a backup. However, if you never backed up the data and don't have a copy of it on another device, there won't be any place to recover it from. :(

    But I'm hopeful that you have a copy of it somewhere, perhaps on the Mac. Please let me know what you find. I look forward to hearing back from you!

  • ajburnetajburnet
    edited November 2016

    Hi - he had never synced it with the Mac as he wasn't a user of the desktop app and there was no way to sync the ios 7 app with a 1Password account either. I still don't see why it overwrote a blank vault on the desktop with a populated vault on the ios app - sync normally infers a more intelligent item level sync, at least in my experience, i.e. don't DELETE items if there is only one entry on the ios app / desktop app combined!

    Anyway, the backup set on the ios app was with icloud. It synced with the (empty) vault on the desktop app, removing all items, and then the ios app apparently synced with icloud, removing the backup in effect. Suffice to say, all is gone, there was no backup option other than icloud / dropbox (which he doesn't use).

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    @ajburnet: I'm sorry for the confusion. This really does sound like the nightmare that I've been through myself in the past when I didn't backup my data. Sync is not the same thing as backup, as all changes will be sync'd — including the removal of data. That's why we include a backup/restore feature in 1Password. "Sync" implies that you have the same vault on each device, and then changes on one will be sent to the other. 1Password's WLAN Server can only track changes based on sync history, and when you sync two distinctly different vaults, results can be unpredictable. But in this case it's pretty clear that the newer data replaced the old, which resulted in the empty vault supplanting the older one with data in it. And in the case of iCloud, the newer vault replaced the old. I'm really sorry that I don't have better news for you, but we don't have access to 1Password users' data to restore it when it's been deleted. :(

  • Thanks again for your reply, much appreciated!

    I understand the difference - however in this case that ios app has no Backup option available when used without a desktop app, which of course comes at quite a considerable cost compared to your competitors.

    I still think the logic in that version should have been better, I would not expect a blank vault to overwrite populated data, and if it did there ideally should be some sort of warning before it does that. Perhaps the newer app is better (which I use myself, but without the wifi sync).

    My only feedback is that 1Password seems to be focused on ever more features and in my humble opinion, is in danger of becoming bloated and overly complicated for the less technically savvy (such as the old man!).

    Thanks,

    Alex.

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    Thanks again for your reply, much appreciated!

    Likewise! I hate not having a solution for your predicament, but I appreciate your feedback here too.

    I understand the difference - however in this case that ios app has no Backup option available when used without a desktop app, which of course comes at quite a considerable cost compared to your competitors.

    1Password for iOS does not require the desktop version of 1Password to backup data. As I mentioned earlier, it has a built in backup/restore feature. Like other iOS apps, it uses iTunes File Sharing to let you transfer the data to save a backup.

    I still think the logic in that version should have been better, I would not expect a blank vault to overwrite populated data, and if it did there ideally should be some sort of warning before it does that. Perhaps the newer app is better (which I use myself, but without the wifi sync).

    I agree that what happened isn't good at all. But while you shouldn't have to worry about things like sync state and the technical challenges of determining if it should keep the older vault when a new on is introduced, backing up important data is critical. Even if that hadn't happened, the data could just as easily be lost due to theft, software bug, or hardware failure. I'm sorry to carry on about this, but I've lost data myself and wish it never had to happen to anyone else.

    My only feedback is that 1Password seems to be focused on ever more features and in my humble opinion, is in danger of becoming bloated and overly complicated for the less technically savvy (such as the old man!). Thanks, Alex.

    I think you're absolutely right. This is a delicate balance. Almost everyone has at least one feature they'd really like added or improved, so not doing so isn't tenable. But at the same time, this can introduce additional complexity, both with regard to usability, and, frankly, bugs. We try to maintain this balance as best we can, but an "outside" perspective from users can really make a big difference. I'd be grateful for any constructive criticism you'd be willing to offer!

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