If I bought 1Password Pro, am I going to have to subscribe in the future?

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Comments

  • @brenty, the word "forever" is conspicuous in its absence from what I actually wrote. That poor straw man never had a chance.

    Look, I write software for a living, too. I understand perfectly well that this isn't marriage, 'til death do us part. But the fact the the future is uncertain and the technological landscape is filled with change somehow doesn't prevent other software vendors large and small from creating, and disclosing to their customers, product roadmaps and support plans detailing where they think they're headed in the immediate, near, and even long term. For some reason you guys are balking at that. When I turn up here expressing my concern that you're going to EOL standalone 1Password within a relatively short timeframe in favor of a SaaS offering that doesn't meet my needs, you act as if it's creepy and weird when I fail to be reassured by repeated non-reassurances -- and then get exasperated that I'm not satisfied with your inability "to offer something more definitive."

    I do appreciate Steven's post, but it doesn't really help me. I care only somewhat about where you are today, and not at all about your journey over the last year. What I want to know is where you think you're going to be six months or a year from now (which is hardly the same as "forever"), so that I can make some informed choices about whether to retain 1Password as part of my tool stack. If things are going to continue much as they have, that's great, but if the cost of upgrading to 7.0 is going to be that I have to get on your subscription hamster wheel and put my passwords in the cloud, I might as well get a head start on replacing you. And if you truly, incredibly, don't have a roadmap that you can disclose to your customers, permit me to suggest that you make one, ASAP.

  • edited March 2017

    @violent_sociopath when you're asking AB for a commitment to a future, standalone version of 1Password, I'm curious how much would you pay for that future version? Would you commit to pay a certain amount?
    Or maybe the other way around: if AB would go the same route as Twitterific with their upcoming Mac client and finance the standalone version of 1Password via Kickstarter, how much money would you pledge?

  • I just registered and dropped in for the sole purpose of voicing my support for you continuing to offer a standalone license option if you do move forward with another major release in the future. I am willing to pay for major upgrades, but I do not wish to move to any type of subscription model. I have no problem with you offering a subscription model as an option, but I would like you to continue to offer a standalone license option. I don't require a response, but I feel it is important as a customer across many major revisions of 1Password that I communicate with you as to how I would like to continue to be a customer in the future. Please allow me to continue to be your customer by providing me the option to buy a standalone license.

  • BenBen AWS Team

    AgileBits Team Member

    And if you truly, incredibly, don't have a roadmap that you can disclose to your customers, permit me to suggest that you make one, ASAP.

    We have never published a roadmap. We announce new versions, new features, changes in offerings, etc as those changes are ready to roll out. We're not rolling out any changes to standalone licensing and as such there is nothing to announce. We will not commit to any specific timeframe for the continuation of that business model as that comes with its own problems. Folks then expect a change after the committed timeframe when there may be no plans for one.

    I'm sorry but I can't give you what you are looking for.

    Ben

  • @Manaburner: I haven't found the historical pricing onerous. ~$65 for the desktop app would be fine by me.

    @Ben: Last summer, shortly after you guys launched your subscription offering, AgileBits employees like Dave Teare and Eva Schweber were running around the comments sections of sites like TechCrunch and 9to5Mac saying things like this:

    I'd like to assure you that we have no intention of elminating out stand-alone license option. We have many users who rely on us to be able to sync their data over WiFi/WLAN and keep their data off of the cloud. In fact, we are continuing to put development time and resources into improving our stand-alone app. So while it is true that we can eliminate the stand alone option, it is clearly not where we are going as a company.

    (Emphasis mine.)

    Around the same time, AgileBits employees on these very forums were just as unequivocal:

    All that said, lots of people simply want to buy an app once and start using it. We totally get that. And that's why we have no plans to stop providing the 1Password apps for individual purchase. We're going to keep supporting anyone who chooses to use the apps that way, and the individual apps will continue to see new features and developments provided in free updates.
    If you purchase a 1Password single version license instead of a subscription:
    Get updates for the version your purchased. For example, if you buy now, you’ll get all updates to 1Password 6 for Mac. 1Password 7 for Mac will require a separate purchase.

    (Again, emphasis mine.)

    Eight months ago AgileBits didn't seem to have a problem making exactly the kinds of statements that you're apologetically insisting you cannot make today. I'm at a loss.

    No need to reply further.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    That's just what we mean. Since you're looking at things we said last year and applying them to today, it's clear that whatever we say now may be taken as gospel months down the road. And since we don't have anything new to share about licenses today (apart from what you already know: that they've been deemphasized), it doesn't seem very helpful for us to make up something else to tell you just because you keep asking. We'd rather wait until we actually have something definitive to say to you and others who are curious, since a definitive statement is ostensibly what you're asking for.

  • TheMacMommyTheMacMommy Junior Member

    I've been using and evangelizing 1Password since version 3. I currently hold a license for 1Password 6 Version 6.5.5 (655000) from the AgileBits Store. I've also run the betas for years until this last little hiccup with the expired something or other that made me have to reinstall it...I'll get back to the betas soon though, promise! I am a consultant for small businesses and a computer teacher to senior citizens. I have sold most of my clients (as well as family members) on your software for the better part of a decade. I have a mixture of clients (and family) to support and I also train them on how to use 1Password. I live 1Password so I can teach 1Password. For some of my clients, I install the free version at least on their iPhone or iPad because while they may not actually use it, it helps ME help THEM by keeping their passwords in a place where I can get to them and just copy and paste. I don't actually even need to see their passwords and I really don't want the liability of remembering or personally storing passwords for 80 year olds. I use 1Password very slowly with them, sometimes only storing the main 3 accounts they might need so I can teach them about password hygiene, to wean them off of using the same password for everything. Senior citizens are major targets for identity theft, so I try to help them when their identities have become compromised or prevent it from happening in the first place as I slowly help them develop their digital footprint. I also use 1Password as an estate planning tool. I help people and their families gather important information, put it together in their 1P vault and, in some cases, print out a hard copy for their chosen point of contact for handling their estate and/or medical care. (Who knew there would be so many medical portals and security questions and answers the older you get!!) I'm a sort of digital undertaker, as it were. Even after death, their identity and pieces of it still needs protecting and transfer to remaining family members.

    Some of my clients have both the paid MAS version as well as the paid iOS version. Some only have the iOS paid version, many have the free iOS version because they are still confused about what a password even is, but we'll get there. These are people who need teeny, tiny, little baby steps. Password management is a really, really abstract concept for many yet. Of course I see the value in your product, but then I have to turn around and play the part of salesperson when it comes to getting and keeping them on board. It's also MY reputation as a consultant on the line. I very, rarely ever install third-party software on a client's system because of how it could break a workflow the client and I have spent time (and their money) to build. My clients pay me an hourly fee to help them accomplish something. It is not easy for me to turn around and tell them they need to spend more money on additional software. It could mean the difference between whether or not I get called back, so I must tread very carefully. Most are on a fixed income. For most of my clients, simply syncing to iCloud is all they ever need. They usually live on their own or with a spouse where they share a single account. They may have between 1 to 3 devices to sync. Needs are extremely basic.

    Let's talk about me again — the one who gobbles up all this yummy 1Password dog food so I can live it to teach it. Sometimes I use 1Password in a Teams capacity, except I can not expect those I work on projects with to just pony up for a teams account, so we've been using Dropbox to sync small amounts of passwords between us. The system I currently have, which is a mixture of iCloud and Dropbox between myself, family members, and colleagues just works and I'm really happy about that. If I make the choice to continue to use the licensed store-bought version of 1Password 6 with my home-grown way of doing things, I understand that I'm responsible for supporting that, and if it breaks, I knew the risks and if it stops working, well then, it will be time to pony up for the MAS version and/or move to the subscription model. Until that time comes, however, here's what I need to know and want to better understand...

    Help me help YOU AgileBits — I need to find a way to explain to my clients (read: old people who need it simplified) what will happen for each flavor moving forward?

    • App Store Peeps: I have some clients who paid their $64.99 in Mac App Store and their $9.99 in iOS App Store and I told them once they purchased it, that was it, unless there was some major upgrade down the road, but by then they'll be hooked and I can explain their options for paying to upgrade or remaining while possibly degrading a quality user experience. These clients simply sync with iCloud between a Mac and an iPhone, maybe an iPad as a 3rd device, that's it. Will that change? Will they receive a notice to upgrade or make an in-app purchase to continue using iCloud or will iCloud no longer be supported in favor of your server sync?

    • What will happen to my freeloaders? The ones who only have the limited free version on their iPhone? They don't need, want or understand the extra paid features yet. For them, the free limited version is plenty. Will they ever get a message saying they need to pay something to continue use? Another colleague told me she refuses to use 1Password with her clients because they get a message saying their trial version is up, asks for money and then they get mad so she gave up on it. I've never had that happen with my clients, so I'm looking for some clarification on that process. I have them make their own master password, we write it down and store it somewhere safe then I install the app on their iPhone for them, bypassing signing up for an account. I then go directly to Settings > Sync and select iCloud. It never asks them for money. Will this continue to work this way? Why are my friend's clients getting messages saying their trial ended, but mine are not? Is there a picture walk-through I could point her to so she can use it the way I do? I really like being able to offer my clients a free version with the hope that they will come around and pay the upgrade because over time I will show them the value of the paid features as they become more confident in their learning goals for using their tech.

    • How about my clients who have the free version on their iPhone but then want to install the (now) free trial version on their Mac from MAS? Will that version of 1Password sync between their Mac and iPhone and then just stop syncing or disallow editing after the 30 days is up? Do we basically have 30 days to get everything they're ever going to use entered and then it becomes read-only after that 30 days on the Mac? What if they only make edits to entries in the iOS version? Is it that they just won't sync to the Mac anymore and that's the point where they can decide if paying for the Mac version is worth it or pinch their pennies and clutch their pearls and stick with the free iPhone version? Of course, I'm willing to advise clients to go ahead and install the Mac version now that it's free to install from MAS, but I want to be very clear on what I tell them the consequences are once we install it if they don't want to fork out another $64 plus a monthly subscription fee. Is it one or the other or both that they'd need to pay? Again, these are single people only supporting themselves on a single, fixed income who only need iCloud sync.

    • Here's where I'm still confused after poking around in this forum: (there comes a time when it's just faster to ask even if the answer is to link to someone else's answer on a thread I didn't scope out yet, I'm cool with that) In the MAS it's $64.99 to buy the app — does that mean I can continue to sync with iCloud and/or Dropbox like I have been doing with the agilebits store version if I were to pay again to switch to the MAS version? Do I need to spend $3.99 a month on top of the $64.99 one-time-fee — is the $3.99 monthly the updates-for-free-forever-fee? I have been to the agilebits store to input my license and it told me I could get 1Password at a reduced price, but I'm not sure how that applies to the MAS version.

    • Why is the pricing different? Currently on your https://1password.com/sign-up/ it's $2.99 for a regular plan and $4.99 for Families plan, but in MAS in-app purchases it's listed as $3.99 and $6.99 per month respectively. Why and what's the difference?

    Sorry for the long, scroll-tastic entry, but thank you in advance for clarifications and I hope this helps others who may have similar situations.

  • I though it was Apple matching the figure and not converting the currency here in the UK. One thing for certain is that the pricing is a complete mess.

  • @brenty:

    Since you're looking at things we said last year and applying them to today

    I haven't "applied" anything you said last year to today. You'll search my post in vain for me making a single assumption about whether those statements are still operative. All I've done is contrast how forthcoming and categorical you guys chose to be then, versus how reticent and evasive you're insisting you have no choice but to be now -- the point being that contrary to what you're saying you do have a choice. You're demonstrably capable of making definitive forward-looking statements when you want to. Eight months ago, presumably because at the time you thought it was important to reassure standalone licensees on whose goodwill you depended that you still wanted their business, you wanted to. Now you don't.

    I think that's interesting and (given the way the elephant in the room keeps getting bigger) revealing.

    it's clear that whatever we say now may be taken as gospel months down the road.

    Yes, how dare your customers expect you to be accountable for what you tell them. Don't they know that they should be showing you unreserved bovine gratitude for being given the mushroom treatment?

    Again, no need to reply. I'll be moving on from 1Password, and advising family, friends, and colleagues to do so as well.

  • @violent_sociopath
    Maybe you don't know that, but nobody is forcing you to use the 1Password sync, even if you have a subscription. So this would mean that you could still use your highly secure sync (or not sync) routine and still use any future version because upgrades are included in the subscription.

    Anyway if you still prefer to leave 1Password because of things that might happen in the future, then godspeed.

    advising family, friends, and colleagues to do so as well

    Good luck with that, I can't even convince people to use a password manager in the first place. If I would tell my parents they need to change their password manager, there would be some rough "emergency-remote-support"-times ahead ;)

  • @Manaburner, I'm aware of that. However, AgileBits' entire rationale for the subscription licensing model is to cover their ongoing costs of providing the sync service. It's impossible for me to justify paying a subscription for a service I won't ever use, even with "free" product updates thrown in to sweeten the deal. The juice is not worth the squeeze.

    Best of luck to you, too.

  • Unlike some, I don't mind having my passwords stored in the cloud. I used LastPass for several years and had no major issues with the product, and I trust that 1Password takes all of the precautions necessary to ensure that our passwords are safe. The Dropbox and Wifi sync options can be a real hassle, and maybe even confuse some people. I cannot use Dropbox on my work machine, and since it's a desktop, wifi sync is out. That means I'm stuck manually copying over the database to the work machine.

    However, the pricing is a factor for me. I paid around $50 for my Windows/Mac license (which I share with my wife AND was also the sale price) and $10 for the iOS app for me, plus the $10 iOS app for my wife's phone. If I use the service for three years, that works out to about $2/mo. However, with the current pricing, I would be paying $5. Sure, we're not talking about large sums of money here, but that's still a 60% increase. How would you feel if your cable bill or cell phone bill increased by 60%? I'm sure most people would consider going with another provider.

    Although the development team won't admit it, or might not even know entirely, I suspect that the development of standalone version will end with the current version (6 for macOS and 4 for Windows) of 1Password. I also suspect that we won't ever see version 6 for Windows. After all, it's been 2 years since version 4 was released. What would be the purpose of having a standalone edition and a subscription edition, especially when you consider that 95% of users will be fine with the cloud subscription.

    I'm happy with where I'm at now with the standalone product, but when/if the standalone version reaches end of cycle, and a new Windows version never gets released, I'll strongly consider going back to LastPass.

    Once again, we aren't talking about large sums of money here, but when I can get the entire Microsoft Office 365 suite for $99/year, and Netflix for $120/year, it seems crazy to pay $60/year for a password manager, especially when you consider that the competition is either free or $12/year (LastPass).

  • RootyRooty Junior Member

    Agilebits: I will NEVER pay a subscription and nor will any of my acquaintances. And for you to claim that this isn't really about generating more money is frankly insulting. It's always been an overpriced product for what it does, but to be fair it does it well and I like it for what it is. But a subscription -- never.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    @Rooty: Thanks for letting us know. It does seem a bit over the top to be "insulted" that we're asking people who use our new service to pay us for our work, but just as you're entitled to spend your hard-earned money where you see fit, you can think what you want about us. I think our track record speaks for itself though. And it seems reasonable to assume that you wouldn't have money to make purchase decisions if you weren't paid for your work. So I don't think us wrong of us to do the same, nor are we trying to hide that.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    @attrapereves: Thanks for taking the time to share your perspective. Indeed, at this stage, we're not thinking of a new version in more than abstract terms, as we've got our hands pretty full with everything we're working on now — notably with the brand new Windows app we debuted back in October. We've got some ideas for the "next" 1Password(s) too, but we've got our work cut out for us already...and I don't think we're quite at 95% adoption for 1Password.com either. I think it's fair to point out that 1Password isn't cheap, but that isn't something we're ashamed of: we're proud to offer a premium product (and support) that's supported solely by our customers, rather than selling out, selling ads, or selling you. As much as I'd like to say I get more out of my Netflix subscription, because I depend on 1Password for all aspects of my life (and don't have tons of time to kill watching videos), I get a lot more use out of it. Your mileage may vary of course, and you've got to decide how to prioritize your spending like any of us. But I'll leave you with two thoughts: though hard-fought, it sounds like you've got a setup that works for you so there may be no need to worry about making a change; but it's very likely that 1Password.com will allow you to access your data across all of your devices without all the hassle, so it may be worth giving the free trial a chance. A big reason 1Password.com exists is to make peoples lives easier by solving just this kind of problem.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    @telUK, @TheMacMommy: I wanted to address the question of App Store pricing separately since you both mentioned it — and since the rest deserves a whole response on its own:

    • Why is the pricing different? Currently on your https://1password.com/sign-up/ it's $2.99 for a regular plan and $4.99 for Families plan, but in MAS in-app purchases it's listed as $3.99 and $6.99 per month respectively. Why and what's the difference?

    This is really simple, but, admittedly not obvious: the App Store doesn't have a lot of flexibility with regard to subscriptions (or making changes to them), so we're only able to offer the monthly rate there currently. Whether you subscribe through iTunes/App Store or our site directly, the price is the same for monthly plans; but at this time we're only able to offer annual billing through our site, and paying for a year upfront gets you a 20% discount. I hope that clarifies things!

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member
    edited March 2017

    @TheMacMommy: First of all, thanks for your long-time support, and for helping others secure their digital lives. We can make software, but we can't be everywhere, so I love hearing from folks like you who are able to touch so many people's lives directly. :blush:

    I know firsthand that subscriptions can sometimes be a hard sell, but I think that they're the best option for most users, and especially those who don't have a technical background or interest in fiddling with all this stuff. While I can't speak for you, I think we may be kind of on the same page here, just based on your comments: How great would it be to be able to spend more time on the work you really love, rather than troubleshooting sync or data loss issues? For us, what we want to be doing is making 1Password better so our customers get more use out of it. They don't want to be fighting with sync configuration or searching for licenses; they just want it to work. That's why 1Password.com exists. And for you, your trying to teach people all of these concepts, and when setup takes up too much of the session or something happens to someone's iPad and they lose everything you've worked for together, I can imagine you might wish things were simpler — not for you, since obviously you're comfortable with all of this by now; but for the folks you're helping, being able to scan a QR code to add a new device (and not worry about another purchase, or sync individual vaults) or have them login to 1Password.com and see that all of their data is safe even after a disaster could be a game changer (an Emergency Kit in the appropriate hands means that there's a way forward even under the most unpleasant circumstances). So while many folks may have relatively "basic" needs as far as devices or usage, the simplicity alone can be a breath of fresh air.

    Getting "back to TheMac(Mommy)", I did want to address something you mentioned about 1Password Teams. I may have misunderstood, but it sounds like you're using Dropbox and/or iCloud to supplement that for some clients. I can't say if this is a perfect fit for you depending on the size of your business, but it sounds like Guest accounts might be useful in some of these situations. If you've got the 1Password Teams Standard plan, you'll have 5 Guests included in your base subscription, whereas 1Password Teams Pro includes 20 Guests in the base price. Any more Guests past that are just billed as additional members based on the price of your plan. Depending on the situation, these might be a better option for clients, as it's easier to setup and manage, since a Guest gets access to a single vault you share with them. Also know that if something breaks in 1Password, while it's certainly awesome that you take it as a personal challenge to figure it out, it isn't your sole responsibility. We're here to help! Even the helpers need that sometimes. And that goes for your you, your family, and your clients, whether using a license, a subscription, or a "freeloader" — we're here to help all 1Password users in any way we can.

    With regard to your questions about specific user situations, there's a lot of overlap. I'm sorry it's been as confusing as this, and deemphasizing the standalone versions has already helped to simplify things...but as you're here because everything still isn't crystal clear, I apologize for that. We'll continue to try to improve things in this area, and I'll do my best to fill in the gaps that remain today. The main takeaway is that none of this changes things for existing 1Password users, regardless of the category they fall into. They can continue with the setup they have forever unless it breaks due to hardware.

    • App Store Peeps: I have some clients who paid their $64.99 in Mac App Store and their $9.99 in iOS App Store and I told them once they purchased it, that was it, unless there was some major upgrade down the road, but by then they'll be hooked and I can explain their options for paying to upgrade or remaining while possibly degrading a quality user experience. These clients simply sync with iCloud between a Mac and an iPhone, maybe an iPad as a 3rd device, that's it. Will that change? Will they receive a notice to upgrade or make an in-app purchase to continue using iCloud or will iCloud no longer be supported in favor of your server sync?

    Just to be clear, those who purchased the standalone apps and sync their own data won't have to make any adjustments or pay anything else. As long as the setup works for them and they're happy, I'd say they should stick with it. But if the day comes where they have trouble syncing or setting up new devices, it may be worth considering 1Password.com to streamline both — and then they never have to worry about whether or not they can upgrade to a new version either.

    • What will happen to my freeloaders? The ones who only have the limited free version on their iPhone? They don't need, want or understand the extra paid features yet. For them, the free limited version is plenty. Will they ever get a message saying they need to pay something to continue use?

    The only way someone gets the "frozen account" message is if they've signed up for a 1Password.com Account and not subscribed after 30 days.

    I think you're right on that the free version of 1Password for iOS is sufficient for a lot of people. My biggest concern is that folks who are overwhelmed by advanced features and not interested in paying for them are also likely to have the same issues with backing up or paying someone else to do it. Frankly, it seems like most people across the board don't backup, and don't appreciate the importance until it's to late. So, counterintuitively, many of these people are those who would benefit most from 1Password.com securing and backing up everything they put into it, without them ever needing to give it a second thought.

    Why are my friend's clients getting messages saying their trial ended, but mine are not?

    It sounds like they're signing up for a 1Password.com Account during the setup process, which is the default for new users. Existing users can sync their data from another device, and from your description above it sounds like that's what you're doing.

    • How about my clients who have the free version on their iPhone but then want to install the (now) free trial version on their Mac from MAS? Will that version of 1Password sync between their Mac and iPhone and then just stop syncing or disallow editing after the 30 days is up? Do we basically have 30 days to get everything they're ever going to use entered and then it becomes read-only after that 30 days on the Mac?

    As for existing users, any changes that are made to data on one device should sync to the others. But if they're using a trial/free version, they may not be able to make changes in the first place. For example, 1Password for iOS without the Pro upgrade (or a 1Password.com subscription) only supports creating or editing Logins, Secure Notes, Identities, and Credit Cards (though it can read others sync'd from a different device). New 1Password users on any platform though will be prompted to create a 1Password.com Account, and they'll have 30 days to try it before paying. If they don't subscribe, they'll still have access to their data, but it will be read-only.

    • Here's where I'm still confused after poking around in this forum: (there comes a time when it's just faster to ask even if the answer is to link to someone else's answer on a thread I didn't scope out yet, I'm cool with that) In the MAS it's $64.99 to buy the app — does that mean I can continue to sync with iCloud and/or Dropbox like I have been doing with the agilebits store version if I were to pay again to switch to the MAS version? Do I need to spend $3.99 a month on top of the $64.99 one-time-fee — is the $3.99 monthly the updates-for-free-forever-fee? I have been to the agilebits store to input my license and it told me I could get 1Password at a reduced price, but I'm not sure how that applies to the MAS version.

    Indeed, we're here to answer, so there's no harm in asking! You kind of touched on this above, but I want to be crystal clear: Anyone who has already purchased the apps they need should not also subscribe unless they need/want the benefits of a 1Password.com membership. And it's never necessary to purchase the same license for the same individual twice. But if there's anything we can help with when it comes to recent purchases, please shoot us an email at support@1password.com with the details so we can help. And if you post your Support ID in reply here, I'll can take a look and get back to you faster.

    Anyway, I hope this helps answer some of your questions and concerns. Please let me know if you have any others! :)

  • Wow... As a recent purchaser of the MAS version 6 I have developed concern over my purchase after reading this complete thread. To be clear, I am a proponent of the standalone version of this app for the many reasons cited by those commenting preceding, this, my first post. It seems the person who started this thread and those following up had a simple question as to the potential phasing out of the standalone product.

    For what it is worth, and more an observation than a critique, it seems to me the the AB respondents answered the questions like politicians. It seems clear to me that AB only wants to support a subscription model version of their software. I say that because the AB staff skewed their comments in that direction as a strong rebuttal and offered vague semi-assurances for existing standalone users.

    Being a new customer/user, I don't have a lot of skin in the game. My needs are simple and I echo those comments related to self reliance for backups of my passwords. I've come to like the 1Password standalone product but If AB goes in the other direction of only offering subscriptions I will seek an alternative.

    I am not seeking a response. I registered solely to support the requests for a standalone version of 1Password.

  • Hot dicussion... ;-)

    As a am using 1Password since Feburary of 2011 and I purcased a couple of major versions for Windows, Mac and IOS, and I really liked what you guys did. Until now! The only feature I was missing was some options for syncing to own servers, but I used WLAN sync and it worked for me. I would never sync my password fault to any cloud serivce, so sorry I completly agree with @violent_sociopath . The subscribtion model doesn't fit for me, too.

    Why don't you guys just add an "expert options" tab in your settings with the following features:
    1) Sync to OwnCloud, webdav and WLAN service
    2) Add standalone licence key (which can be purcased in your store)

    All the bad mood would be gone ;-) All the guys complaining would have the perfect solution, and you get 100% of the customers, and beside this all the tech guys like me would contunue to recommend your software.

    But it seems like you made your choice. Very very sad, because I really liked your software. Maybe you can provide the specification of your 1pif format to support your unhappy customers with a better exit option.

    lOwTek

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    @jhsonderb: Thanks for taking the time to do so. I'm sorry that there's so much confusion. The simple, straightforward answer regarding the future of standalone licenses that we've given already is as follows: We don't know. But many have asked meta-questions in followup (such as "Why not?"), and that's where things get a little into the weeds. No doubt, as we move to develop future versions of 1Password we'll be able to offer something more definitive concerning the future. But it isn't the future yet.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    Why don't you guys just add an "expert options" tab in your settings with the following features:

    @lOwTek: "Expert options" are a lot of work for features that the vast majority of people will never use, and we do need to focus our efforts on what will do the most good for the greatest number of 1Password users.

    1) Sync to OwnCloud, webdav and WLAN service

    These are great examples of features that some advanced users would absolutely love (including some folks at AgileBits), but which most users won't ever benefit from, and many novice users would try to use and get themselves in trouble. We really don't want to help 1Password users make their experiences worse, and especially with regard to WebDAV, the experience was much, much worse (even from the nerd perspective of efficiency), so we scrapped it long ago.

    2) Add standalone licence key (which can be purcased in your store)

    This can already be done. We have a lot of users (myself included) who have purchased licenses and still use them. I'm not sure I'd call it a "feature", but regardless we haven't removed it. We're just not actively marketing licenses since 1Password.com is better for the vast majority of people — just like we don't promote WLAN Server.

    All the bad mood would be gone ;-) All the guys complaining would have the perfect solution, and you get 100% of the customers, and beside this all the tech guys like me would contunue to recommend your software.

    Unfortunately there are a lot of pet features that advanced users want. None of them will satisfy all advanced users, and each of them requires resources to develop, test, maintain, and support.

    But it seems like you made your choice. Very very sad, because I really liked your software. Maybe you can provide the specification of your 1pif format to support your unhappy customers with a better exit option.

    1PIF has been an open format from the start, and there are plenty of implementations out there. It's just JSON, so load it up in your text editor of choice and you'll have everything you need. I'm glad you've enjoyed 1Password, and it seems a bit premature to talk about abandoning it when it continues to work the same way it always has for you, but we believe strongly that you should be able to take your data anywhere.

  • KylereillyKylereilly Junior Member

    I too am not someone that likes to pay recurring subscription fees. I love Dropbox syncing, have never had a problem with it, and prefer to buy my licenses outright. The frustrating part is all I want to know is simple - when will 1Password stop supporting the licensed versions, or will stop development on non-recurring plans? That will let me know when I need to move over to another password manager. As an early adopter, I LOVE 1password, it just simply works - but paying monthly? That's just too much - 1 time is so much better for my situation, and for that of many people.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    Thanks for letting us know. If that's the direction we go in the future, we'll be sure to share that.

  • I just registered to say that I, too, am concerned about the direction 1Password is going in.

    The sole reason I switched to 1Password several years ago was that I am able to buy it once and sync over WiFi. I have no need for any new features or Cloud sync as long as the app works on the current version of my OS and updates that might come out in the near future (shouldn't be a problem since Apple rarely deprecates major APIs).

    Don't get me wrong, I'm a software developer myself and I get that you need to be able to cover your expenses but a password manager is one of those things that really don't need to be SaaS product. I'd happily purchase each new major version of 1Password though, like I always did till v6.5.

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    I just registered to say that I, too, am concerned about the direction 1Password is going in.

    @substance90: Thank you for taking the time to reach out and share your thoughts!

    The sole reason I switched to 1Password several years ago was that I am able to buy it once and sync over WiFi. I have no need for any new features or Cloud sync as long as the app works on the current version of my OS and updates that might come out in the near future (shouldn't be a problem since Apple rarely deprecates major APIs).

    That makes sense. If what you have already meets your needs, you can continue using that setup. We just couldn't sit still while so many other people were either suffering through figuring out licenses (and upgrades) and troubleshooting sync issues — or giving up on 1Password altogether in frustration. You and I are good with things like Wi-Fi configuration, but most people just aren't into that.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm a software developer myself and I get that you need to be able to cover your expenses but a password manager is one of those things that really don't need to be SaaS product. I'd happily purchase each new major version of 1Password though, like I always did till v6.5.

    Since you're comfortable managing all of this yourself, maybe a service doesn't make sense for you right now. I can definitely see both sides. Sort of how I used to love building my own computers. Frankly, part of me would love to do that even today, but I don't have as much time on my hands to devote to putting all of the pieces together. And similarly, I find that 1Password.com is welcome, especially in the sense that I don't have to do as much tech support for my own family. Not that I mind, but typically they're not having a good time when they have to come to me in order to get things done. And I'm okay with not being the bottleneck anymore. ;)

  • It annoys me to hear people complaining about subscription (aka cost), everything valuable cost money - this is normal in this world.

    Constant updates for new system releases (both iOS & macOS) with new constraints require a lot of work.
    Having subscription is beneficial for both sides, for the developer who can release faster updates & upgrades, and for users, who can receive more value (security, features etc.) faster.

    I like agilebits for sticking to their beliefs with not satisfying everyone ;) this is a bold statement and very honest (like whole communication from your side since I remember, and I'm with you many years).

    Paying for something, which delivers value for you (selling you more time basically) is no brainer.

    For everyone who is still offended by subscription, please divide the monthly price per number of days and then see if that $0.xx is a "good deal" for saving you a precious time, multiple times a day.

    Anyway, all best and stay strong everyone :)

  • It annoys me to hear people complaining about subscription (aka cost), everything valuable cost money - this is normal in this world.

    Constant updates for new system releases (both iOS & macOS) with new constraints require a lot of work.
    Having subscription is beneficial for both sides, for the developer who can release faster updates & upgrades, and for users, who can receive more value (security, features etc.) faster.

    I like agilebits for sticking to their beliefs with not satisfying everyone ;) this is a bold statement and very honest (like whole communication from your side since I remember, and I'm with you many years).

    Paying for something, which delivers value for you (selling you more time basically) is no brainer.

    For everyone who is still offended by subscription, please divide the monthly price per number of days and then see if that $0.xx is a "good deal" for saving you a precious time, multiple times a day.

    Anyway, all best and stay strong everyone :)

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    @kreatywny: Thanks for the kind words, and sharing your perspective. This is probably going to seem crazy to some people (my past self included), but I feel similarly and have been contemplating moving to a "subscription" for hardware as well.

    For example, Apple offers a plan to pay monthly and get a new iPhone every year with AppleCare+. Until now I've been paying out of pocket for each upgrade. That's a huge chunk of change to drop at once, but the idea was that I could sell the old one and recoup some of the cost.

    But in practice I just ended up giving them away to friends and family because frankly selling is a huge pain and often involves a lot of time haggling with buyers, and the cost of selling online. Also, I take really good care of my phones, but they're never in perfect condition after a year or two of daily use, so that cut down on the value as well. So then I'd give them away to save myself the trouble and benefit a friend or loved one...but now that's becoming a liability as well, as they are inherently older devices which wear out or stop receiving updates. I kind of feel bad about that. So I'm leaning toward just paying monthly and always having the latest iPhone. And Microsoft is doing something similar with Surface hardware now I think, so that's interesting as well.

    The funny thing is that while a software/service subscription is not the same thing, it makes even more sense. With the iPhone, purchasing outright gives me the option to resell it at least, but that just isn't possible with software; I don't actually own anything in that case, as it's licensed. I also used to own a house, but I really don't miss it since renting means that someone else has to fix things when they break. Software is similar, because if there's a bug I'm not going to fix it myself. I'd rather leave that to someone who knows it inside and out. And paying a subscription means that I get a lot of other benefits too over time, and the people who work on it will be there if I need them, like a landlord: if they go away, the building won't be maintained, and I'll end up having to find a way to fix the plumbing at some point. Not the way I want to spend my time. ;)

  • My account seems to have been frozen and I am now being asked for a monthly subscription to continue using 1Password. Why? On reading some of the other comments it seems that this is what happens. I do not want to get involved in regular payments so I am leaving 1Password and deleting all the info from my iMac. How do I do this?

  • brentybrenty

    AgileBits Team Member

    @KENNETHMOOREFRCS: I think there may be some confusion. You can continue using 1Password as you have been. We think that 1Password.com is the best option for most people since it offers so many benefits not possible with the standalone apps...but like most things, if you don't want that you don't have to pay for it.

    If you really want to delete 1Password and all of your data, you can do that. But you can keep using the app(s) you paid for without an account (Settings/Preferences > Accounts to sign out) instead if you wish. And if you would like to take advantage of the things 1Password.com has to offer, shoot us an email at support@1password.com and I'm sure there's something we can do to help. Cheers! :)

This discussion has been closed.