Long time 1Password 4 user trialing version 6

Hello,

I've recently installed 1Password 6 and i'm trying to get a feel for it and how it compares to version 4 and I have some question that I hope you can help with.

Attachments

I've imported all my data from 1Password 4 and I can see my existing attachments have sort of moved over. I say sort of because they are no longer embedded into the 1Password login, secure note etc but exist outside as a separate item.

I've got to say my initial feeling about this is that I don't like it. It worked so much better in 1P4 as the attachments were kept out of the way until needed and didn't get in the way of the 1P data like logins etc. For instance on some of my software licences I attached a receipt, this is something I most likely will never need but want to keep it around just in case. In 1P4 I can add the receipt as an attachment to the actual licence and I never have to see it again unless I need it.

In 1P6 attachments are showing up as a separate item in Documents but even worse they show up under the all items section as well and just get in the way of the stuff I access daily. I'm struggling to see any benefit here and wonder why items and attachments have now been separated in the interface even though you're specifically attaching it to a single item. It wouldn't be too bad if they were hidden out of the way but they are right there alongside all the 1P items that I access all the time.

Are there any plans to change the attachments\documents side of things to remove this split and only show attachments that are relevant to the item you're viewing instead of always showing alongside the primary items?

Also I've not been able to work out how you actually attach files to items in 1P6, how do you do this?

Re-arrange sections\fields

How do you re-arrange sections and fields that have been added, i'm not seeing any drag handles or up/down arrows?

Nested tags

Over the years I spent quite a while organising all my items into various folders and sub-folders and I can see in 1P6 that folders have gone and only tags remain. I wouldn't have minded this if tags could be nested but seeing as I now only have a flat list of tags this feels like another step back compared to what I have in v4.

One big long list of tags isn't great for organising so I wonder if nested tags are coming any time soon?

Flag?

In the dropdown where you change between vaults I see a flag with the name of my family next to it. This is located beneath "All Vaults" and above my private vault. I can select the flag but the contents appear to be identical to what I see when I select the all vaults option. What is this flag?

Finally I've assigned pictures to all my vaults which I see online but on Windows the picture for my private vault isn't showing, is this a bug?

Thanks that's everything for now.


1Password Version: 6.7.457
Extension Version: Not Provided
OS Version: Windows 10
Sync Type: Family

Comments

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    Hello, I've recently installed 1Password 6 and i'm trying to get a feel for it and how it compares to version 4 and I have some question that I hope you can help with.

    @reck: Sure thing! Thanks for checking out 1Password 6, and taking the time to reach out with questions and feedback! :)

    Attachments
    I've imported all my data from 1Password 4 and I can see my existing attachments have sort of moved over. I say sort of because they are no longer embedded into the 1Password login, secure note etc but exist outside as a separate item.

    Sorry for the confusion! In local vaults, attachments were files which were literally part of another item. With a 1Password.com account Documents are the files themselves, saved to your account, and they can be linked to other items.

    I've got to say my initial feeling about this is that I don't like it. It worked so much better in 1P4 as the attachments were kept out of the way until needed and didn't get in the way of the 1P data like logins etc. For instance on some of my software licences I attached a receipt, this is something I most likely will never need but want to keep it around just in case. In 1P4 I can add the receipt as an attachment to the actual licence and I never have to see it again unless I need it.
    In 1P6 attachments are showing up as a separate item in Documents but even worse they show up under the all items section as well and just get in the way of the stuff I access daily. I'm struggling to see any benefit here and wonder why items and attachments have now been separated in the interface even though you're specifically attaching it to a single item. It wouldn't be too bad if they were hidden out of the way but they are right there alongside all the 1P items that I access all the time.

    I get that it's different, and that there's going to be some apprehension because it's not what we're used to, but Documents are just much more flexible. You can upload files of nearly any size to your account (provided you have enough space there, of course), and they can be linked to multiple items — for example, I have a few different Documents linked to my Identity with personal information, just so they're easy to find. That said, I agree that there's room for improvement with the presentation of this new feature, so I appreciate your example of Software License receipts. Hiding them is something we can consider, but truthfully I don' find they get in my way because any time I search for something I'm only getting results for what I've searched for. Food for thought.

    Are there any plans to change the attachments\documents side of things to remove this split and only show attachments that are relevant to the item you're viewing instead of always showing alongside the primary items?

    Not currently, but Documents are still fairly new so we're always happy to receive suggestions like this. Thank you! :)

    Also I've not been able to work out how you actually attach files to items in 1P6, how do you do this?

    Currently this is done only during the import process, but we'll be adding the ability to link items together in a future update of the new app. Thanks for letting us know you're looking forward to this feature!

    Re-arrange sections\fields
    How do you re-arrange sections and fields that have been added, i'm not seeing any drag handles or up/down arrows?

    Drag handles aren't available in the new app yet, but it's something we're working on. In the mean time you can move custom fields within sections by selected them in Edit mode and pressing Alt ↑ or Alt ↓.

    Nested tags
    Over the years I spent quite a while organising all my items into various folders and sub-folders and I can see in 1P6 that folders have gone and only tags remain. I wouldn't have minded this if tags could be nested but seeing as I now only have a flat list of tags this feels like another step back compared to what I have in v4.

    Thanks for letting us know. I have to disagree that it's a step backward since tags aren't limiting (both organizationally and technically) the way folders were, but certainly it's a personal preference. We don't have plans to bring back folders, but we'll be adding more advanced tag management as well, so I'd love to hear the sorts of things that you might like.

    One big long list of tags isn't great for organising so I wonder if nested tags are coming any time soon?

    You can always search for tags using tag:tagname, both in the main app and 1Password mini. Search is your friend: super fast and way easier than scrolling through all of your data!

    Flag?
    In the dropdown where you change between vaults I see a flag with the name of my family next to it. This is located beneath "All Vaults" and above my private vault. I can select the flag but the contents appear to be identical to what I see when I select the all vaults option. What is this flag?

    That's your account. You can set a different icon for it in your account settings on 1Password.com. Since many people have multiple accounts (personal, business, etc.) it's helpful to be able to select just one if desired, both for searching and saving. And setting a cool icon can help you differentiate vaults quickly at a glance too. :sunglasses:

    Finally I've assigned pictures to all my vaults which I see online but on Windows the picture for my private vault isn't showing, is this a bug? Thanks that's everything for now.

    Ah, that does sound like a bug. I believe this is fixed in the latest beta. If you sign out and sign back in that should refresh everything there in the mean time though until we have the next release available to everyone.

    I hope this helps. Be sure to let me know if you have any other questions! :)

  • Hi Brenty,

    Sorry i'm not sure how I go about actually linking documents to existing items. If I upload a pdf for instance how do I link that to an existing login or safenote for instance?

    I think I could get used to this, the main issue I have is the visibility of the attachments, or documents I guess. I just don't tend to need them very often and on the off-chance I do I would just go to my password for instance and load the document from there. For me personally I would prefer that they weren't visible alongside the main 1Password items such as logins, safenotes etc. I don't use 1Password as a document storage container like I would say Dropbox and only attach documents when I have something I want to associate\link to a 1Password item.

    Thanks for the tips about rearranging fields, can you do the same with sections? That was one of the annoying things about version 4. If you wanted to rearrange the sections you had to delete the entire section(s) along with all the fields, hopefully that's been addressed in the current version.

    I've taken another look at tags and I personally think there's still work required here. For instance when assigning tags, there's no auto-complete\lookup when you're typing the tag so it would be very easy to spell something slightly differently without realising, e.g. app instead of apps. I've noticed that the tags seem to be case sensitive as well as I have separate tags for "apps" and "Apps" which isn't great, is that intentional?

    Finally there doesn't appear to be a way to assign a tag to an item from the tag list itself. I tried drag and drop and right-click looking for a way to do this but neither worked.

    I do understand the power of tags and how they compare to folders but I think to get the best of both you have to support nested tags so you can get some kind of hierarchy going. If this was implemented I wouldn't mind seeing the back of folders.

    By the way my 1Password iOS apps still work with folders under the organise section and i'm still able to create new folders. Seems a bit strange I can use folders in one app but when I move to view my stuff on my PC folders aren't a thing.

    Thanks

  • I believe linking is only fully functional on macOS, but I would love to be proven wrong, as I want to do this on iOS and Windows as well.

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member

    @XIII: You're correct. As I mentioned above,

    Currently this is done only during the import process, but we'll be adding the ability to link items together in a future update of the new app.

    We'll be adding this to each platform in time.

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member
    edited November 2017

    Sorry i'm not sure how I go about actually linking documents to existing items. If I upload a pdf for instance how do I link that to an existing login or safenote for instance?

    @reck: I apologize for not being clearer. Currently this happens as part of the import process. There isn't a UI in the new Windows app for item linking yet, but it's something we're working to add.

    I think I could get used to this, the main issue I have is the visibility of the attachments, or documents I guess. I just don't tend to need them very often and on the off-chance I do I would just go to my password for instance and load the document from there. For me personally I would prefer that they weren't visible alongside the main 1Password items such as logins, safenotes etc. I don't use 1Password as a document storage container like I would say Dropbox and only attach documents when I have something I want to associate\link to a 1Password item.

    I appreciate that feedback! I haven't heard that before, but I can see what you mean. It's something we can consider. We just don't want to make people think they've lost data because it's hidden and they cannot find it.

    Thanks for the tips about rearranging fields, can you do the same with sections? That was one of the annoying things about version 4. If you wanted to rearrange the sections you had to delete the entire section(s) along with all the fields, hopefully that's been addressed in the current version.

    It's only possible to rearrange custom fields within a section in any of the apps. Most people don't spend as much time as you and I might organizing things — they just use 1Password to save and fill important information — so this isn't our top priority right now. We do want to make it possible to rearrange fields more freely, and sections as well, in the future though.

    I've taken another look at tags and I personally think there's still work required here. For instance when assigning tags, there's no auto-complete\lookup when you're typing the tag so it would be very easy to spell something slightly differently without realising, e.g. app instead of apps. I've noticed that the tags seem to be case sensitive as well as I have separate tags for "apps" and "Apps" which isn't great, is that intentional?

    Tags are case-sensitive, yes. But autocomplete/suggestions is something we'll be adding that will help with that. We're in complete agreement here. 1Password 6 and 1Password.com were both released last year, and while both are great we also have a lot of work to do to make them more powerful. Using tags gives us a lot of room to grow in both cases, but we have a lot do do before we can take advantage of all that they have to offer.

    Finally there doesn't appear to be a way to assign a tag to an item from the tag list itself. I tried drag and drop and right-click looking for a way to do this but neither worked.

    Correct. Drag-and-drop and other methods to assign tags aren't implemented yet. We're working on that, but for now it is necessary to add a tag by editing the item itself.

    I do understand the power of tags and how they compare to folders but I think to get the best of both you have to support nested tags so you can get some kind of hierarchy going. If this was implemented I wouldn't mind seeing the back of folders.

    Even if we were using folders going forward, the same problems would exists for them in that we're building an app from scratch and simply don't have all of the affordances implemented to make tags easier to use. We'll get there though, and I really appreciate your constructive criticism about this!

    By the way my 1Password iOS apps still work with folders under the organise section and i'm still able to create new folders. Seems a bit strange I can use folders in one app but when I move to view my stuff on my PC folders aren't a thing.

    If you're seeing folders in 1Password for iOS, it's because you're using a local vault there. Folders are not used at all in 1Password.com, so they won't be shown there when using a 1Password.com vault. If you need help setting things up there, just let me know!

    Thanks again for taking the time to share your experiences with us. It sounds like everything else is working well for you, and you're just looking forward to improvements in tag management. I can't promise a time frame for an update there, but it's something we've been laying groundwork for behind the scenes. :blush:

  • @brenty Thanks for your dialogue about this.

  • MikeTMikeT Agile Samurai

    Team Member

    On behalf of Brenty, you're welcome. Please do keep sending us your feedback, it really is helpful to us.

  • Sorry for dragging up an old thread but I wanted to follow up on this as i've now moved onto version 7 RC.

    As you could probably tell I wasn't a big fan of version 6 so I stuck with good old version 4 but now i've purchased 7 I wanted to see how it compares.

    My biggest gripe with version 6 was how it handled attachements or "Documents". Documents were visible as seperate entries in the interface and in my opinion got in the way instead of being enclosed in the item where it was initially attached.

    In version 7 i'm not seeing Documents and i'm not seeing attachments listed anywhere other than where they were initially attached. Does this mean you've switched back to the version 4 method for attachments? If so I think this is a great thing and makes the application a lot neater to use.

    I'm just wondering if there's any difference between how version 4 and version 7 handle attachments?

    One other thing I mentioned when I was trying out verison 6 was that there were no drag handles to move fields and sections around. I see the Alt up arrow /down arrow shortcut still work but would have thought drag handles would have been in at this late stage in version 7 development?

    Also there still seems no way to reorder sections without deleting and recreating them, will this be addressed?

    Thanks

  • brentybrenty

    Team Member
    edited May 2018

    @reck: I'm sorry for the confusion there. 1Password 6 only supported attachments insofar as it could import them from a local vault into a 1Password.com account, where of course they would be converted to Documents. 1Password.com uses Documents (a separate item for each uploaded file) instead of attachments (literally a file attached to another item), and 1Password 6 only supported 1Password.com accounts.

    So what you're seeing in 1Password 7 is that it supports both local vaults (as a standalone app with a license purchase) and 1Password.com accounts (as a subscription), and supports attachments and Documents for each respectively. So noting has really been "switched back"; it sounds like you're just using local vaults, and therefore won't see any Documents, as those don't exist there. I hope that helps clear things up.

    Regarding reordering sections and fields, the former is not possible in the desktop apps but it's a feature we would like to add in the future, and the latter can be moved within a section using Alt and or . I hope this helps. Be sure to let me know if you have any other questions! :)

  • Ah ok that clears that up then. I much prefer the implementation in version 7 without the seperate Documents area so happy with that.

    Thanks

  • GregGreg

    Team Member

    Hi @reck,

    If you prefer local vaults with attachments, we are completely okay with that. :chuffed:

    Let us know if you have any other questions, thanks! :+1:

    Cheers,
    Greg

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