"Cloudless" laptop sync solution: How to sync a MacBook Pro to already-synced iMac and iPad?

DavidD

Using 1Password 5 for Mac to use wi-fi to sync a Retina iMac running Yosemite with an iPad went very well. Your instructions were great and this was easy to set-up. However, extending use of 1Password 5 to a MacBook Pro laptop (also running Yosemite) is not so straightforward.

Here is the situation. My iMac contains the 1Password 5 database which syncs easily with my iPad using wi-fi. However, my wife has a MacBook Pro laptop, wants to use 1Password Pro and desires to AVOID putting 1Password data into the cloud. Our guess is there are many actual or potential 1Password users who are looking for a cloudless laptop solution. (For example, her cousin in Oregon to whom I recommended 1Password last weekend. Both families have the goal of keeping our sensitive data OUT of the cloud, period.)

My wife's MacBook Pro has 1Password 5 installed (downloaded from the Apple Store) but does not have a database yet. Initially, there seemed to be two ways to expand 1Password 5 use to the laptop without putting any data in the cloud:

(1) Use wi-fi to sync the MacBook Pro to the iPad

This assumes one iPad could sync with two Macs. Although this would be a handy solution, this didn't work for us. If you know a way to make this happen, please let me know. My guess is 1Password 5 only allows sync with one Mac. (Note: This would be a VERY handy feature for future releases and may well be easy to implement.)

(2) Sync folders between the iMac and the laptop using ethernet and OS X file sharing

Unfortunately, your instruction page for 1Password for Mac Folder Sync (https://guides.agilebits.com/1password-mac/5/en/topic/sync-folder) is vague compared with your clear instructions for using wi-fi to sync with IOS devices.

(Note: The first challenge was locating the 1Password for Mac database to share. This took some doing. I finally found it in the knowledge base at https://guides.agilebits.com/1password-mac-kb/5/en/topic/data-locations. It would be helpful to future new users to post this link in the https://guides.agilebits.com/1password-mac/5/en/topic/sync-folder page.)

Although the iMac has Time Machine and other network-attached storage, laptop connection to the iMac is intermittent. At first blush, it doesn't seem as if using folder sync should be all that hard. Unless I'm mistaken, using ChronoSync or rsync isn't necessary. However, I'm unsure of the following:

(A) Would intermittent connection of a laptop using ethernet/file sharing be a bad idea?

The warning banner on your Folder Sync page makes me wonder if it is worth pursuing this solution. The risk of database loss doesn't seem to be a problem due to multiple 1Password backups on my iPad (further backed up to the iMac under iTunes), multiple backups on the iMac and Time Machine backing up the iMac. On the other hand, I'm unsure about the risk of database corruption due to use of two types of sync on the iMac (wi-fi to the iPad and file sync to the MacBook Pro.) Wi-fi sync to the iPad now happens throughout the day. Ethernet/file sharing file sync with the laptop would probably occur only a couple of times per month.

(B) If this is not a bad idea, what is the best/safest way to do this?

Step by step, what is the best way to initialize the 1Password database on the MacBook Pro using our iMac 1Password database? If this is as straightforward as I suspect it might be, then it may make sense for you to include these instructions on your Folder Sync page.

(C) Is there a better solution for using 1Password on my laptop without having to use the cloud?

The best possible solution for laptop users wanting to avoid use of cloud storage would be wi-fi sync for laptops like IOS devices. Your wi-fi solution is both simple and elegant. Expanding this to cover laptops would avoid use of ethernet cables as well as the need for intermittent use of file sharing.

Allowing a single IOS device to do wi-fi sync to more than one Mac would solve the problem. Again, this may already be in place but this didn't work when I tried it last night.

However, there may be yet another method you know which I haven't found yet. Any thoughts would be quite helpful.

Thanks!

DavidD

Update: I gave Folder Sync a try while having file sharing turned on. The sync process seemed to start but then displayed a "Never Synced." error message. I saw what looks like a similar problem addressed in the following thread: https://discussions.agilebits.com/discussion/32179/sync-bug-on-local-folder-sync-edit-and-delete. Am I on the right track?

littlebobbytables

Hi @DavidD‌

As I think you've since guessed, we don't recommend simply sharing the location of the sqlite file that represents the vault when stored locally. This is why the data locations aren't mentioned in the Folder Sync guide. The sqlite file is a database so reading and more importantly writing to a database from more than a single process has to be handled very delicately, something 1Password won't do as it hasn't been designed for that kind of scenario. You also can't merge two sqlite files using any standard sync methods.

When you use the Folder Sync method it creates the same type of sync data as if you used Dropbox. What it creates is a package (a special folder to OS X) titled .agilekeychain. Inside this package there is a single file per vault item and although your standard sync methods can't read the contents (because it's all encrypted) they can determine which version is newer based on time stamps. So they compare each item and keep the newer one.

Here's the tricky part. When you sync using either Dropbox or iCloud, you're working off a locally stored copy that is always present. So no matter what general internet connectivity you have the contents of your Dropbox are accessible (although maybe not up to date). So 1Password has been built up with the assumption that the sync location is always available. This breaks down if you use a networked location for Folder Sync as maybe a laptop leaves the office/house or you accidentally get disconnected briefly. In both instances 1Password becomes unhappy.

So what we recommend is if you wish to sync between two machines without using a cloud solution is when you set up Folder Sync you pick a location on your HD/SSD. This way you always know that it will be available. Then you use something like rsync or ChronoSync to keep the local copy synchronised with either another machine directly using Apple's File Sharing or something like a Network-Attached Storage (NAS) device.

So with your situation I'd suggest the following. Your iMac isn't mobile so make that the 'server' and you would configure FolderSync to store the agilekeychain somewhere accessible if you were intending on using rsync you'd want to enable File Sharing. If you were considering using ChronoSync along with ChronoAgent then ChronoAgent replaces needing File Sharing (if I've understood correctly) and location isn't as important.

On the MacBook Pro you would also use Folder Sync and again, store the agilekeychain somewhere locally. Then you would need to configure rsync or ChronoSync to synchronise the two copies when both are available. A brief inspection of the ChronoSync website would indicate you would install ChronoSync on the iMac and ChronoAgent on the MacBook Pro. Then, when the two could see each other they would sync. You then need to ensure your sync method isn't merely looking at the timestamp of the package and instead the individual files inside.

Now we've mentioned rsync and ChronoSync but any sync method should work. Given the wealth of options that's why the instructions start getting hazy and we say we can't offer support for the abundant options out there.

I understand I haven't supplied a detailed list of what to do but does this better help understand how Folder Sync should be used?

With reference to the "Never Synced" message, I suspect if you were to close 1Password and reopen it that message will change. I don't tend to pay much attention when it claims it has "Never Synced" during my troubleshooting experimentation so I wouldn't worry too much about that, I believe we will fix that.